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My personal crosswind limitation


Jim

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Is something less than 15G18 straight across the runway. Tried it three times Saturday, no passenger, no baggage, light on fuel. Almost succeeded on the third attempt and then a gust hit me just before I could get the low wheel down. Diverted to an airport 5 miles away with favorable runway and the landing was a non-event.

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Hi Jim,

 

Next time you get one of those winds try zero flaps and 2700 rpm to the ground. This has worked for everyone at my field in their CT and for everyone I have instructed to try this. My last couple that flew in to Ryan the winds the wife commented that it was his best landing in the wind over his calm wind landings.

 

 

 

I've been able to handle 25-30, but it is with zero flaps and power all the way to the ground. I use 2700-2900 rpm depending on my weight. 2700 by myself and 2900 at 1320+.

20-25 winds is never an issue any more. For me full stall landings in these types of wind gives up to much aircraft control and leaves you more susceptible to the gust and wind direction changes. When controls are mushy and you have no flying speed and little to no prop wash over the tail you leave yourself open to being manipulated by the winds more. With all the three above I can counter act the wind. The worst time for many is the few moments just before touch when speed is close to stall or just above. The tail dragger pilot uses throttle for tail authority so can we.

 

This method hasn't let me down since 1980.

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I get lots of crosswind practice. My limitations are mostly turbulence related. If I can fly an approach and the winds are big I look for a window between the gusts.

 

The things that make me abort are:

  • too much shear
  • too much sink
  • winds changing from less than 90° to greater than 90°
  • too little rudder

The numbers coming from the AWOS tend to be wrong, when you land at 20G40 it really isn't that high.

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Roger, at 0° flaps and 2700rpm, doesn't your speed get very high?

 

Depends on pitch attitude. I couldn't hold altitude with that so I could raise my nose until stall speed or keep it low and do a 100mph Roger Lee landing. When I land with power I favor adjusting the throttle as my energy state changes instead of using a given setting. This assumes gusts, smooth winds are a different matter.

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High crosswind landings MUST be done with a slip and 0 flaps with at least 62kts approach. By high I mean 8kts to 18kts wind and gusts.

 

And you will land on one wheel at a time, so be ready for flaring on one wheel.

 

MUST? Sounds like you are quoting a rule or requirement. Where does that come from?

 

Configuration and approach speeds are pilot's option. There are 3 methods, crabbing, de-crabbing and side-slip, they all work.

 

You don't flare on a wheel you settle on it or them as the result of a flare. I mostly see CT pilots land on both wheels though I prefer one. If you land on one then you have the correction in at the time you need it the most.

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I am also interested in knowing if you are still a student CTLSi. I am a low time pilot 200 hours. I disclose that so you will all know that my comments on flying technique are opinions that are based on that experience. There are those on this forum who have a ton more experience than I have. I respect what they have to say.

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I have a different philosophy on crosswind landings. I am also a low time new sport pilot. I have 170 hrs and am approaching 60 years old am had my license for 18 months.

 

I have done some crosswind work and while I was soloing I spent an afternoon working on landings 15G25 but only 10 -20 degrees off the centerline. Made every landing but a lot of work. I have also worked with CFI after license working on crosswind landings a couple of times but don't plan on doing any significant xwind on planned flights. The weather is good enough here and I fly for fun so I won't go flying if the winds are going to be challenging.

 

I practice xwind for if I get caught out, not normal flying. Maybe I'm getting too safe in my old age. Also most of my passengers are rookies and I've already had one get sick on a flight.

 

 

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I should add that I have landed in 16g23. Since my airport has 90 deg. cross runways I usually do not deal with direct crosswind. I have done one wheel landings without issues. My biggest concern is usually taxing.

The other day I was going to fly to WI for the Rotax Line Maintenance class but the gusts were reaching 31 if I was at the end of the runway I would have been good - the other end of the trip was good. I drove. (Nine hours vs. four.)

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Close to the same story, Dan, except I am 63 and haven't had a sick passenger... yet.

It was my boss that was pretty insistent on flying the day we went. I told him multiple times that it wouldn't be dangerous but would be uncomfortable. He said bumps were not a problem for him. It wasn't bad winds just low ceiling and I knew that we were going to bounce around under the overcast. After 1 1/2 hrs of trying to get there (ceiling kept dropping from 2800' to 2200' even though TAF's indicated ceiling lifting), we turned for home and about 30 minutes out he grabbed the gallon freezer bag that I keep my fuel tester in in the passenger side pocket.

I briefed him on this option because I knew it was going to be bouncy. BTW I got great fuel economy as I was throttled back the entire flight :) and made a very smooth landing.

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Remember that you can land at an angle across the runway to substantially reduce the crosswind component.

 

You may even get lucky and have a high speed turnoff you can use if your landing runs a tad long.

 

Remember, if any portion of the crosswind is down the runway, you can often land at near walking speeds and get stopped in a remarkably short distance.

 

Anyway, set myself up recently at Peru, IN to angle into a pretty strong left crosswind. Hit ground effect and the wind pretty much subsided, so I just landed right of centerline - only 10° of flaps which you guys know is pretty rare for me!

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They are only crosswinds if you are not pointed into the wind. Some of these runways are 200 feet wide here. Practice touching down exactly where you want to. Keep your speed up a bit and fly to exactly your spot. You can make the runway somewhat wider if you land into a taxiway during the final roll out. Air controllers just want you to be predictable and out of the way. Make sure your taxiway is empty. FLY AIRCRAFT UNTIL TIED DOWN. Most accidents I have seen are taxi related at the larger airposts. Sometimes getting to close to a Dash 8, or ATR 72, P3 or C-130 as they move onto runway does not end well. Of course C17 or C5a much worse. Watch for wake as they lift off. Pick you day. Know you limits.

 

Or just go flying with caution and have fun.

 

Farmer

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Our runway was placed perpendicular to the prevailing winds so we get lots of crosswind practice here in Bisbee. The CT handles crosswinds up to its published demonstrated of 16kts without much trouble though it is some work for the pilot! I choose 0 flaps in cases where the crosswinds are greater than 10 kts so I maintain good aileron authority throughout the flare, touchdown and rollout. Most get in trouble right during the touch because of a tendency to relax the aileron input back to neutral which causes the upwind wing to lift, the nose to weathervane and the aircraft to slide down wind. It is imperative to continue increasing the crosswind correction inputs as the aircraft slows. I also like a approach with some power and a few extra knots of speed in anticipation of the increased drag caused by the side slip correction. Know your limits both personal and the airplanes. Consider options like diverting, another runway, taxiway, etc. always be ready for a go around,and by all means don't stop flying the airplane until its in the hanger. Take an experienced CFI with you when you decide it's time to increase your personal limits for crosswind.

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