Colorado Springs

[WarEagle07]

Hello all. Just wanted to introduce myself. I am Brannon, and I am flying/ learning out of KCOS in Colorado Springs. I have about 16 hours in the CT, and will be taking my check ride sometime in the next coupe weeks. 

[Jim Meade]

Welcome to aviation. Do you rent or own?

I've had my CT from Iowa to Florida twice, Denver twice and Dallas as well as a raft of shorter trips. It's not a bad cross-country plane for what it is. How do you expect to fly?

If you've been lurking for a while you probably have a feel for the community. If you are brand new, you'll get to know our brighter and duller moments pretty soon.

[WarEagle07]

I rent from Peak Aviation. I plan on finishing my Sport, then moving on to private after the winter. 

[Jim Meade]

Since you are moving on, I hope your CFI is a Part 61 Subpart H instructor, not a Subpart K. Otherwise, you can't count the time training as a Sport Pilot toward the Private. You probably knew that.

Pilots of America and the AOPA have good forums for beginning general aviation pilots.

What kind of flying do you envistion? Long cross country or family trips, vacations, or what? Sometime take a chance to go up in a glider and get an hour or so where you really learn good stick and rudder skills. It's well worth your while if you don't have to count pennies too closely. There is a lot of soaring out there. Soaring Society of America SSA has sites if you aren't familiar with any yourself.

[WarEagle07]

He is able to instruct all the way to multi cfi. I want to fly professionally after I finish college. May end up going to a flight academy to get my ratings past private. 

[WarEagle07]

Well I am lucky enough to have a family member pay for all of my check ride fees, as long as I take it step by step. I honestly just want to fly at the moment just to make sure it is for me in the long run. 

[Jim Meade]

Fly professionally? Let's see, start out flying Navajos or Cessna 402s hauling freight and medical teams all over the front range. Graduate to King Air's when you get some time. Make about $20,000 a year. Sleep in FBO recliners. Move airplanes around at 0400 and maybe push some snow to get a clear of the hangar door. Be on call so no drinking. What's not to like about it?

When people ask me about flying professionally, I recommend they go to dental school. Dentists can afford to fly nice airplanes when and where they want.

[WmInce]

Fly professionally? Let's see, start out flying Navajos or Cessna 402s hauling freight and medical teams all over the front range. Graduate to King Air's when you get some time. Make about $20,000 a year. Sleep in FBO recliners. Move airplanes around at 0400 and maybe push some snow to get a clear of the hangar door. Be on call so no drinking. What's not to like about it?

When people ask me about flying professionally, I recommend they go to dental school. Dentists can afford to fly nice airplanes when and where they want.

 

It treated me pretty well for 42 years.  20 in the military and 22 with a major airline.

Yes . . . you have to "pay some dues," but the rewards far outnumber the drawbacks.

Even my last flight as a professional pilot . . . it was like having a day off . . . and getting paid for it.

 

I went through my entire career with the thought, "most people would do what I was doing . . . for nothing . . . on their weekends.

 

No regrets.  It was a great ride.

And I am very grateful. . . .

[Duane Jefts]

It treated me pretty well for 42 years.  20 in the military and 22 with a major airline.

Yes . . . you have to "pay some dues," but the rewards far outnumber the drawbacks.

Even my last flight as a professional pilot . . . it was like having a day off . . . and getting paid for it.

 

I went through my entire career with the thought, "most people would do what I was doing . . . for nothing . . . on their weekends.

 

No regrets.  It was a great ride.

And I am very grateful. . . .

You said it right Bill.  I would never discourage anyone from the taking up the flying route.  I think it is better than working for a living.

[Doug G.]

I cannot speak from experience, but it seems that the current situation is different than in the past, is that true?

[coppercity]

Hello all. Just wanted to introduce myself. I am Brannon, and I am flying/ learning out of KCOS in Colorado Springs. I have about 16 hours in the CT, and will be taking my check ride sometime in the next coupe weeks. 

Welcome aboard!  Sounds like your doing well with your training.  If there is anything we can do to help don't hesitate to ask!

[Jim Meade]

Most of the airline pilots I've known don't express any happiness in their work. The guys flying G5s and Citation 10s for John Deere and Leer for Bridgestone and Falcons for Alliant do like their jobs. The mostly kids (or part-timers) flying C402s, Citation 1s and King Airs are for the most part glad to be flying, but they aren't making much money and if they don't break into the higher end corporate jets they are stuck with the current equivalent of flying chicks and checks in old airplanes to little airports in all kinds of weather. My charter career was fairly short and mostly what I described in C402s, King Air 90s and Citation 1s and 2s. It was fun, good experience and sometimes rewarding (like when you are flying organs to a recipient) but it was low pay, bad hours and bad weather in old airplanes. My observation is there are a lot of dues to pay for a long time before one gets into the really good jobs. I'm back to full-time farming (and farm prices are below the cost of production, so maybe I should have stayed flying checks. )

[Anticept]

Some of us love to fly and don't mind the "you own what you wear and have packed on your back" way of life. Of course, i wear airplanes so...

[sandpiper]

My daughter and her husband are FedEx and fly internationally. They seem to love it. Yes, they had to "pay their dues" like most do.

 

Personally, I would find their kind of flying, around the world each month, really long legs, few take off and landings, etc, to be boring after the first several times.

[Duane Jefts]

Most of the airline pilots I've known don't express any happiness in their work. The guys flying G5s and Citation 10s for John Deere and Leer for Bridgestone and Falcons for Alliant do like their jobs. The mostly kids (or part-timers) flying C402s, Citation 1s and King Airs are for the most part glad to be flying, but they aren't making much money and if they don't break into the higher end corporate jets they are stuck with the current equivalent of flying chicks and checks in old airplanes to little airports in all kinds of weather. My charter career was fairly short and mostly what I described in C402s, King Air 90s and Citation 1s and 2s. It was fun, good experience and sometimes rewarding (like when you are flying organs to a recipient) but it was low pay, bad hours and bad weather in old airplanes. My observation is there are a lot of dues to pay for a long time before one gets into the really good jobs. I'm back to full-time farming (and farm prices are below the cost of production, so maybe I should have stayed flying checks. )

Jim,

 

Corporate and charter flying is sporadic with pay and working hours - many late nights.  It is my experience that anyone that could get on with the "majors" would.  I did a fair amount of hiring for TWA and started their internship program with several flight colleges.  We would hire those interns with minimum time.  They had a relatively short time "paying their dues".  There are ways to prevent years of waiting if one is driven to flying for the majors.  The pay isn't that bad after the first couple years.  The job allows various airplane choices, working hours, and management choices.  I don't know of any pilots that went from a "major" airline to corporate flying or charter flying etc..  There must be a reason for that.

[FlyingMonkey]

An EAA friend just got a flying job.  It's an aerial survey job flying a 172 to various parts of the country, then flying defined GPS tracks with a camera package.  It a tough job, seven months like a military deployment moving all around the country.  It pays in the low $20s (more if he's careful with the $110 daily expense stipend he receives).

 

But he's excited...he's flying for a living, and he's building commercial time toward his dream of ATP.  Hard to find much wrong with that!

[WmInce]

An EAA friend just got a flying job.  It's an aerial survey job flying a 172 to various parts of the country, then flying defined GPS tracks with a camera package.  It a tough job, seven months like a military deployment moving all around the country.  It pays in the low $20s (more if he's careful with the $110 daily expense stipend he receives).

 

But he's excited...he's flying for a living, and he's building commercial time toward his dream of ATP.  Hard to find much wrong with that!

 

In the profession, it's called "paying your dues."

Hope it all works out for him.

When he's finally sitting in the left seat of a B-787 or A-350, he will look back on this stint as one of the stepping stones to the career he aspired to.

 

There is more than one way to get there.

His story is one of many.  It just depends on how bad you want it.

It's all about sacrifice and determination.  And I might add . . . some luck!

Definition of "luck" . . . . when preparation meets opportunity.

[Jim Meade]

Some of the stories are about the prototypical 20-22 year old single male with a yearn for adventure and few expenses.

Make the guy 25-30, throw in a girl friend or wife, child, college loan payments, house payments and the "paying one's dues" salary is impossible make work. The wife puts her foot down or the girl friend goes down the road. No doubt, each of us tells the story from our preferred perspective. Rose colored glasses are not only for UV protection.

[sandpiper]

Some of the stories are about the prototypical 20-22 year old single male with a yearn for adventure and few expenses.

Make the guy 25-30, throw in a girl friend or wife, child, college loan payments, house payments and the "paying one's dues" salary is impossible make work. The wife puts her foot down or the girl friend goes down the road. No doubt, each of us tells the story from our preferred perspective. Rose colored glasses are not only for UV protection.

Pretty close to my story. After 3 years flying for my uncle, and with two kid and an engineering degree, I had to pick one - flying or engineering. At that point, paying my dues would have been too difficult, at least for me. The rest is history and flying was always a fun hobby.

[Farmer]

We all have a story about our flying. I first soloed 51 years ago. Never ever go paid for flying, it was a practical means to another end. My pickup truck was always more important, the tractors even more important yet. First aircraft just for fun was three years ago CTLS. As I look back I might have been having more fun than I thought, it was just never top of mind. Now trying to have much fun as law allows.

 

Farmer

[Jim Meade]

Do you fly on Oahu? Which airport? I used to live 3 miles from Dillingham.

[Farmer]

I farm the fields on the mountain side of the Dillingham airport just outside the fence, those fields are mostly bell peppers all year around. My small interest in farming in Michigan is not going well this year, a good crop but low prices. Hope your area is having good fall weather and yields.

 

We currently have two aircraft in two state hangers at HNL international. Bit of a humbug but we had to leave the State hanger at PHJR where we have been for many years. Historical upgrade to the WWII building. My son and I have just received the lease and permits to build a new hanger at PHJR. The drawing show a 60 x 80 x 18 with a one piece upward swinging door on each end. I think it might be a generational transfer of wealth issue For more than twenty years we lived and were based on Molokai. Still have an active farm there now in it's 42nd year.

 

We would welcome anyone who visits Oahu to just give a call, most days weather allows a trip around the pattern.

 

Farmer

[Jim Meade]

Are there glider operations out of Dillingham, too?

When I lived on the North Shore in Waianai in 1969-70, my neighbor had a Breezy he based at Dillingham. Neat to see it fly down the shore about 50' over the palm trees.

[Farmer]

Brian still flys a breezy around Oahu almost each week, all year. He keeps it ay PHJR and gliders are as many as every at Dillingham. The Piper PA 235 tow plane ran out of gas this week and pilot put it into 5 feet of water just off beach. Beach crowded with people. Many skydivers every day. They run two King Air 90. A 7AC that I owned in the 70's has been restored to better than new, still no electrical C 65. Boeing steersman gives rides. Still quaint place to watch aircraft.

 

Farmer

[Jim Meade]

I don't know if this was the same neighbor. Mine was a LTC in the Air Force. He was stationed at Hickam, his wife worked in Honolulu and his daughter and son-in-law studied at the university. Every day, they'd go to Dillingham and fly a C172 to Hickam on a commute. I thought that was pretty neat.

I don't recall his name. If it was him, he'd be in his 0's or 80's by now. Maybe he sold the plane when he was reassigned. I don't know, as I deployed to RVN from there and from RVN went back to the mainland so I lost track of him.