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Las Vegas GA Shutdown


gbigs

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Obama is in Las Vegas Friday thru Sunday and the TFR goes all the way to the edge of the Mode C veil around McCarran.  All GA is shutdown for those three days.  We called KVGT North Las Vegas to see if we could still get out, they said no, and Henderson, Boulder, all the GA traffic is shutdown for three days - why?

 

OBAMA IS PLAYING GOLF.

Since beginning of the TFR institution, I have thought that it has been overdone to some extent. We can only hope that with time, the size , scope  and length of TFR's might ease off a bit. I have to say, that to shut down a whole city (and its adjacent towns and airports), that has so many visitors, to General Aviation  for 3 days strikes me as a bit excessive. My 2 cents.

 

Cheers

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TFRs are going to get more attention as people realize that UAS (drones) are subject to them. The general public doesn't have a clue, is my guess. Nothing like ratting out your neighbor for flying his octocopter when the POTUS is in town, and then making sure the news media knows about it.

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A few years back at the airport I fly (Calgary Springbank) it became the staging airport for security for the G8 meeting that was held there for 2 days and the government shut it down for 2 WEEKS!

I agree it is out of control and not just in the USA but also here in Canada.

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Thousands are going to lose revenue over the TFR which extends 30nm from McCarran. 

 

No, they won't. TFRs allow air carriers and cargo to continue operating. You can also arrive and depart the outer rings to local airfields, and with special authorization, the inner rings, while on a VFR or IFR flight plan, and in contact with ATC. They can also authorize transitions.

 

The inner ring extends 10 miles. The outer ring extends 30 miles.

 

It's a flight restriction, not a flight prohibition.

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No, they won't. TFRs allow air carriers and cargo to continue operating. You can also arrive and depart the outer rings to local airfields, and with special authorization, the inner rings, while on a VFR or IFR flight plan, and in contact with ATC. They can also authorize transitions.

 

The inner ring extends 10 miles. The outer ring extends 30 miles.

 

It's a flight restriction, not a flight prohibition.

POTUS has been vacationing here in Hawaii at Christmas for about 10 days each year.  The 30 mile radius TRF cover the island of OAHU for all  GA training. No touch and go's, must be on flight plan going to another place, FBI back ground checks, and on "the list".  Not as simple as it might seem.  Do everything right and not on the list, out of luck.  WE cannot even use our private strip.

 

Maybe this year we can send him a free trip to Florida, oh yes he does not need money he is the POTUS

 

Oh well he has not been here since SUNDAY!!!

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POTUS has been vacationing here in Hawaii at Christmas for about 10 days each year.  The 30 mile radius TRF cover the island of OAHU for all  GA training. No touch and go's, must be on flight plan going to another place, FBI back ground checks, and on "the list".  Not as simple as it might seem.  Do everything right and not on the list, out of luck.  WE cannot even use our private strip.

 

Maybe this year we can send him a free trip to Florida, oh yes he does not need money he is the POTUS

 

Oh well he has not been here since SUNDAY!!!

I'm with you on this, it would suck indeed.

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Same with Martha's Vinyard.

 

And, we in Iowa have the joy of entertaining a number of VIPs during the elections cycle as we are an early caucus state. Cedar Rapids is one airport that is big enough to handle AF1 and similar aircraft, so we fall under that joyful umbrella from time to time.

 

I really wonder how much danger there is and how effectively a 30 miles ring is if there is a threat? Oh, well, I'm not speculating here. The Chinese have developed lasers for shooting down UAS, I read. I suppose we have them, too.

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I see "black" helicopters zipping around with free run of KYIP (Willow Run)  when there's a presidential TFR here.  One can only imagine what's going on that isn't seen.  The costs associated with this is huge, besides it being such a PIA to GA pilots (AND Sport Pilots!).  Why doesn't the Gov just put up a couple of F16's to loiter and provide squawk codes to active aircraft while Air Force 1 is coming/going and do away with all the other BS?    

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TFRs are going to get more attention as people realize that UAS (drones) are subject to them. The general public doesn't have a clue, is my guess. Nothing like ratting out your neighbor for flying his octocopter when the POTUS is in town, and then making sure the news media knows about it.

 

And the headline will read:  DEADLY DRONE ATTACK AGAINST THE PRESIDENT THWARTED BY CONCERNED CITIZEN CALL TO AUTHORITIES.       :angry:

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No, they won't. TFRs allow air carriers and cargo to continue operating. You can also arrive and depart the outer rings to local airfields, and with special authorization, the inner rings, while on a VFR or IFR flight plan, and in contact with ATC. They can also authorize transitions.

 

The inner ring extends 10 miles. The outer ring extends 30 miles.

 

It's a flight restriction, not a flight prohibition.

 

Yeah, I think you just have to be in contact with ATC and have Mode C with a squawk code, and you can land within the TFR.  If not, ATC will let you know.  Inconvenient and a PITA, but not really a problem if you really need to go there.

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100Hamburger, on 20 Nov 2014 - 9:33 PM, said:snapback.png

Thousands are going to lose revenue over the TFR which extends 30nm from McCarran. 

 

 

Did you even read the NOTAM related to this TFR?

 

 

 

No pilots may operate an aircraft in the areas covered by this NOTAM (except as described).  

 

Except as specified below and/or unless authorized by ATC in consultation with the air traffic security coordinator via the domestic events network (DEN):
A. All aircraft operations within the 7/10 NMR area(s) listed above, known as the inner core(s), are prohibited except for: Approved law enforcement, military aircraft directly supporting the United States Secret Service (USSS) and the office of the President of the United States, approved air ambulance flights, and regularly scheduled commercial passenger and all-cargo carriers operating under one of the following TSA-Approved standard security programs/procedures: aircraft operator standard security program (AOSSP), full all-cargo aircraft operator standard security program (FACAOSSP), model security program (MSP), twelve five standard security program (TFSSP) all cargo, or all-cargo international security procedure (ACISP) and are arriving into and/or departing from 14 cfr part 139 airports. All emergency/life saving flight (medical/law enforcement/firefighting) operations must coordinate with ATC prior to their departure at 702-262-5955 to avoid potential delays.
B. For operations within the airspace between the 7/10 nmr and 30 nmr area(s) listed above, known as the outer ring(s): All aircraft operating within the outer ring(s) listed above are limited to aircraft arriving or departing local airfields, and workload permitting, ATC may authorize transit operations. Aircraft may not loiter. All aircraft must be on an active IFR or VFR flight plan with a discrete code assigned by an air traffic control (ATC) facility. Aircraft must be squawking the discrete code prior to departure and at all times while in the TFR and must remain in two-way radio communications with ATC.
C. The following operations are not authorized within this TFR: flight training, practice instrument approaches, aerobatic flight, glider operations, seaplane operations, parachute operations, ultralight, hang gliding, balloon operations, agriculture/crop dusting, animal population control flight operations, banner towing operations, sightseeing operations, maintenance test flights, model aircraft operations, model rocketry, unmanned aircraft systems (UAS), and utility and pipeline survey operations.
D. FAA recommends that all aircraft operators check notams frequently for possible changes to this TFR prior to operations within this region.  

 

It clearly says scheduled air carriers and air cargo operations are not affected.  Some flight schools and AG operators could conceivably be affected, but this will at most be a few people, nowhere near "thousands".  And this TFR is scheduled well in advance, so all operators have a chance to reschedule their operations and lose no revenue.  

 

I hate TFRs as much as anybody, but once again in this case:

 

wonka-wrong_zps70dbb84f.jpg

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Tours are affected, i agree. But for flight training: it's simple. Apply for a flight plan, leave airspace, perform training, and return on flight plan. We do it ourselves. TFRs are actually pretty flexible. Plus, it is a great way to show the student how to do a flight plan. Until you have left the TFR though, only the instructor can fly, and most importantly, DONT SQUAWK VFR UNTIL YOU ARE SURE YOU HAVE LEFT THE AIRSPACE. Guy in cincinatti got violated because the controller said squawk vfr before he left airspace, and the secret service told them to violate the pilot.

I feel like the purpose of your rants is to hate on obama more than anything. You are shoehorning in efforts to bash him every chance you get.

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Sorry to make an excepion but it is not as easy in all cases as you represent.  You will notice that at thirthy miles from HNL you are 29 miles offshore over OPEN ocean and mostly in an military warning area when the TRF in in effect for the POTUS.  Ok we are a special place, it did make 80 degrees F today, but still part of the USA.

 

Have a safe and happy weekend

 

Farmer

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He is not my president...he is your mess.

Isn't it bad enough that we can't escape this kind of crap in the press? I did not join this group to read more of it. If you feel the need to air out your political opinions, do us all a favor and post them elsewhere. I just want to come here and and enjoy unadulterated aviation!

:D

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Isn't it bad enough that we can't escape this kind of crap in the press? I did not join this group to read more of it. If you feel the need to air out your political opinions, do us all a favor and post them elsewhere. I just want to come here and and enjoy unadulterated aviation!

:D

Then put him on your twit filter like I did a couple of years ago. You miss nothing - and gain much. It is not our responsibility nor are we able to correct every mistake on the internet.

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