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CTLS flight training?


Cluemeister

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You could have, as we did, BRS install a chute in a Cessna 182.  It was a little pricey but well worth the "security blanket" when you are in the dark with no ground reference.  The 182 was an essential grandchildren hauler, now not so.

 

The 182 is now with someone else, and I am still looking at LSA's.  Hopefully Sebring will have something that meets mission and weight requirements. 

 

Sure hate getting heavier as I get older.

 

It took Cirrus years to design in the BRS chute and they trashed a good number of planes testing it.  And when they added useful load to the SR22T they redid the work.  The BRS for the SF50 jet was a major deal.  I would really be afraid to add a chute to an older plane...you have no real way to make sure it would work when needed.  We ran into this on a Lancair project, in the end there was no way to verify it would work despite the large expense to add it.

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I disagree with you.  That chute is certified for 182's, by BSR, and can be installed at any Cessna service center.  I wouldn't think that the 2016 model 182 is an "older plane".

 

It was tested to the same level that Cirrus was.  During our discussion's with BRS they indicated they were working on a chute for the Cessna 206,  we held off as long as we could hoping that it would be certifiy the 206.  Well it still hasn't happened

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My advice is don't worry about what airplane you may purchase later. If you want a Private license, I would find the best flight school close to where you live and get my training and license in whatever aircraft they have available. Transitioning to a different type aircraft is not that difficult. I transitioned to LSA with 2.5 hours in a SkyCatcher after a 7 year absence from flying. A couple months ago, I got checked out in a Remos with 1.0 hours and today I got checked out in a different Remos with 0.7 hours. Right now, you should be looking for the best training available relatively close to home.

I will second that.

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I disagree with you.  That chute is certified for 182's, by BSR, and can be installed at any Cessna service center.  I wouldn't think that the 2016 model 182 is an "older plane".

 

It was tested to the same level that Cirrus was.  During our discussion's with BRS they indicated they were working on a chute for the Cessna 206,  we held off as long as we could hoping that it would be certifiy the 206.  Well it still hasn't happened

 

BRS doesn't certify a chute for a certified airframe, the manufacturer of the airframe does.  I don't see Cessna adding the chutes to their products, did you do it on your own?  Do you have a link to Cessna options for the chute?     Have you seen a chute pull in a 182?  

 

The 182 was certified back in the 1950s.

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BRS doesn't certify a chute for a certified airframe, the manufacturer of the airframe does.  I don't see Cessna adding the chutes to their products, did you do it on your own?  Do you have a link to Cessna options for the chute?     Have you seen a chute pull in a 182?  

 

The 182 was certified back in the 1950s.

 

There is an STC blessed by Cessna and BRS to add the system to both the 172 and 182.  A little googling will give you all the details.

 

A 182 with a BRS would be a seriously safe and capable machine.

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Check out BRS's  page at: brsparachutes.com/cessna_182_faq.aspx and read, as well as try to understand, the FAQ's regarding Cessna's 182 (as well as 172) BRS parachute installation. 

Parts are available from Cessna Parts Distribution and installation by Cessna's Service Center.

 

Over the last 60 or so years I've had to joy of flying in all shapes and types of aircraft.  Too me it's a joy to be in the air, as it is for most of us.  It's not about "mine is bigger, faster, prettier than your's" it's about having fun and enjoying life. 

 

I am not trying to start a urinating contest with someone who is so narrow minded.  Just stating my experience with this particular type installation.

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My advice is don't worry about what airplane you may purchase later. If you want a Private license, I would find the best flight school close to where you live and get my training and license in whatever aircraft they have available. Transitioning to a different type aircraft is not that difficult. I transitioned to LSA with 2.5 hours in a SkyCatcher after a 7 year absence from flying. A couple months ago, I got checked out in a Remos with 1.0 hours and today I got checked out in a different Remos with 0.7 hours. Right now, you should be looking for the best training available relatively close to home.

I agree (almost) totally with that sentiment.

 

To a new pilot, it appears that every airplane is very different, both in procedures and flying characteristics.

 

But as a pilot adds more and more disparate types to his or her logbook, that perception gradually shifts to them all being fairly similar, albeit with minor differences. Mickey and I and many others on this forum are probably more in this camp.

 

A pilot can learn to fly in anything from a J3 Cub to a Cirrus, and virtually everything in between. Each has advantages and disadvantages, but virtually all will work. Lufthansa was and possibly still is using Bonanzas as primary trainers, for example.

 

But learning to fly can be hard work at times, and to stay motivated a pilot should choose a plane that "touches" him or her on some level. Though one can learn to fly in a clapped out Cherokee 140 or a new CT, one should try to choose the one that brings a smile to their face!

 

Then again, in 1975 I was just thrilled to be in the air in anything with wings. I happened to end up in a C150 because of a deal the local Cessna Pilot Center had going - guaranteed Private Pilot's license for $995(!). And those little Cessnas were just fine, but as soon as I had my license in my hot little hands I was eager to start collecting "types", and let me say I've collected quite a few over the years!

 

But whatever you do, keep the fun in it.

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Here's the very aircraft I trained on to get my PPL - started  in 1989 (Grob 115) - The control tower in the picture is at City Airport Manchester and is claimed to be the oldest tower in the world that has been in continual operation since it was built!

 

Grob_G_115A_G-BOPT_LAC_BTN_26.05.04R_edi

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Check out BRS's  page at: brsparachutes.com/cessna_182_faq.aspx and read, as well as try to understand, the FAQ's regarding Cessna's 182 (as well as 172) BRS parachute installation. 

Parts are available from Cessna Parts Distribution and installation by Cessna's Service Center.

 

Over the last 60 or so years I've had to joy of flying in all shapes and types of aircraft.  Too me it's a joy to be in the air, as it is for most of us.  It's not about "mine is bigger, faster, prettier than your's" it's about having fun and enjoying life. 

 

I am not trying to start a urinating contest with someone who is so narrow minded.  Just stating my experience with this particular type installation.

 

Again, a certified radio in an aircraft does not make a certification for the whole aircraft.  Example, Cirrus wants to replace the G1000 with the Garmin G2000 but needs to undergo a recertification to do so, despite the G2000 being a TSOd piece of equipment already. 

 

Cessna recertified the Corvalis after a delam event and while doing so replaced the G1000 with the G2000 (a smart move), but they did not add the parachute (a dumb move) during that recertification creating today's TTX.

 

If you stuck a BRS chute in a Cessna 182 you just made an experimental out of that aircraft.  And you are assuming the chute will deploy and provide a decent you can survive without any factory testing.

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Again, a certified radio in an aircraft does not make a certification for the whole aircraft.  Example, Cirrus wants to replace the G1000 with the Garmin G2000 but needs to undergo a recertification to do so, despite the G2000 being a TSOd piece of equipment already. 

 

Cessna recertified the Corvalis after a delam event and while doing so replaced the G1000 with the G2000 (a smart move), but they did not add the parachute (a dumb move) during that recertification creating today's TTX.

 

If you stuck a BRS chute in a Cessna 182 you just made an experimental out of that aircraft.  And you are assuming the chute will deploy and provide a decent you can survive without any factory testing.

 

This is not a pissing contest...it's just a statement of facts.

 

The BRS system in a Cessna 172/182 is fully FAA approved under a Supplemental Type Certificate (STC). The STC for the installation was applied for and received by BRS. All required flight testing was done by BRS. It can be installed in any Cessna 172/182 models that are listed on the certificate. The installation does not make the airplane experimental, it stays in the standard category.

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Again, a certified radio in an aircraft does not make a certification for the whole aircraft.  Example, Cirrus wants to replace the G1000 with the Garmin G2000 but needs to undergo a recertification to do so, despite the G2000 being a TSOd piece of equipment already. 

 

Cessna recertified the Corvalis after a delam event and while doing so replaced the G1000 with the G2000 (a smart move), but they did not add the parachute (a dumb move) during that recertification creating today's TTX.

 

If you stuck a BRS chute in a Cessna 182 you just made an experimental out of that aircraft.  And you are assuming the chute will deploy and provide a decent you can survive without any factory testing.

 

Your facts are extremely wrong, however. Barring extraordinary changes to a type design, the Supplemental Type Certificate process allow modifications to existing type designs without redoing the entire certification process for field alterations. For manufacturers, they can produce changes and have a type certificate revision done without redoing the entire process. For example: Type Certificate 3A12, for Cessna 172s, is on it's 84th revision at the moment.

 

Garmin, however, does not provide any G1000, 2000, or 3000 units for retrofits in the large majority of aircraft (there are exceptions), instead providing only to OEM.

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