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Dynon Skyview Page Layout Restrictions

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I'm having trouble understanding why something on the Dynon is restricted by Flight Design USA, assuming it is in fact restricted.  Finally, I'm trying to figure out how to best work with the problem.

 

As a background, I was trying to re-configure the displays for someone in the right seat flying the plane, while I watch over in the left seat.  My normal configuration is 3/4 PFD and 1/4 Engine on the left, and 1/4 Engine and 3/4 Map on the right.  Yes, I know I can swap the screens.  However, there are very significant restrictions.  For one thing, if I just flip this configuration, on the right side it's 1/2 Engine and 1/2 PFD.  Very limited layout options.

 

On the Dynon web site, there's a detailed video, which shows all kinds of display options.  According to the video, you press "Screen" tab, then press the "Layout" tab.  However, on my unit, there isn't any "Layout" tab.  I called Dynon, and they said it was probably disabled by Flight Design.  When I called Flight Design tech support, the person said yea, they probably did do that, but he's not sure.  I can understand requiring the Engine monitor show up on at least one of the displays, and same for the PFD.  But beyond that, I don't know why Flight Design would restrict the options.

 

Anyone else encounter this problem?  Is it in fact a FD issue, or is it something I'm doing?

 

Thanks,

Andy

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I'm having trouble understanding why something on the Dynon is restricted by Flight Design USA, assuming it is in fact restricted.  Finally, I'm trying to figure out how to best work with the problem.

 

As a background, I was trying to re-configure the displays for someone in the right seat flying the plane, while I watch over in the left seat.  My normal configuration is 3/4 PFD and 1/4 Engine on the left, and 1/4 Engine and 3/4 Map on the right.  Yes, I know I can swap the screens.  However, there are very significant restrictions.  For one thing, if I just flip this configuration, on the right side it's 1/2 Engine and 1/2 PFD.  Very limited layout options.

 

On the Dynon web site, there's a detailed video, which shows all kinds of display options.  According to the video, you press "Screen" tab, then press the "Layout" tab.  However, on my unit, there isn't any "Layout" tab.  I called Dynon, and they said it was probably disabled by Flight Design.  When I called Flight Design tech support, the person said yea, they probably did do that, but he's not sure.  I can understand requiring the Engine monitor show up on at least one of the displays, and same for the PFD.  But beyond that, I don't know why Flight Design would restrict the options.

 

Anyone else encounter this problem?  Is it in fact a FD issue, or is it something I'm doing?

 

Thanks,

Andy

 

Flight Design restricts how you can partition the screens.  Since I always keep the PFD full and don't split it, and always keep the MFD split half between engine and half moving map I have never bothered playing with it or caring what the restriction are...

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It is a certification thing. ASTM requires that the airplane be tested for each possible configuration. Flight Design only test certain configurations. The POH reflects those configurations, and they don't want someone in the field making changes that might take the airplane out of ASTM compliance. While you know the changes have been made and it is not a big deal to you, it might be if you sell to someone else and the configuration doesn't match it could be a big deal.

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Flight design has restricted many of the dynon capabilities besides the screen displays.  I wrote a several page letter 2 years ago that Tom P forwarded to Germany but none of the suggested changes have been made. 

 

I think it's wrong to sell a plane with the very capable Dynon system, then restrict many of it's abilities. 

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Another thing...

 

The fuel totalizer has a maximum of 33 gallons.  While it can be reconfigured as far as Dynon is concerned, FD has blocked that as well.

 

The wings have 34 gallons total (33 usable).  The plane has 34 gallons usable, including the header.  I wanted to adjust it to 34, so the totalizer would match the dip stick (which measures total), and it would still match the plane's total usable of 34.  Easy and straightforward.

 

The totalizer isn't even required for certification, and I can defeat it by going to the extra step of "adding a gallon" after I've flown a bit, so why should they care? For those who say why are you concerned about a gallon, I'm not per se.  But, it is very helpful to get a feel for how the totalizer correlates with the factory-supplied dip stick.  I wanted a simple process, but the oversight is prohibiting it.

 

Andy

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It is a certification thing. ASTM requires that the airplane be tested for each possible configuration. Flight Design only test certain configurations. The POH reflects those configurations, and they don't want someone in the field making changes that might take the airplane out of ASTM compliance. While you know the changes have been made and it is not a big deal to you, it might be if you sell to someone else and the configuration doesn't match it could be a big deal.

Tom -- I don't buy this.  There are several other S-LSA manufacturers that allow for their Dynon's to be upgraded directly from the manufacturer's site and allow them to configure the displays to anything that Dynon supports.  Van's apparently has some level of locked settings but does allow the displays to be configured as desired.  FD has made a design decision that places tighter control on these devices but they can't use ASTM as their reason.  It isn't necessary a bad thing -- perhaps they feel this gives them a product that is more easily supported.  I would consider this more intrusive on my ownership privileges than I would want but that's me.

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Tom -- I don't buy this.  There are several other S-LSA manufacturers that allow for their Dynon's to be upgraded directly from the manufacturer's site and allow them to configure the displays to anything that Dynon supports.  Van's apparently has some level of locked settings but does allow the displays to be configured as desired.  FD has made a design decision that places tighter control on these devices but they can't use ASTM as their reason.  It isn't necessary a bad thing -- perhaps they feel this gives them a product that is more easily supported.  I would consider this more intrusive on my ownership privileges than I would want but that's me.

Just relaying what I was told when the skyviews were first introduced in the CT. As a flight instructor I voiced my concern about not being able to have a good view of the flight instruments from the right side.

 

I remember back when the FAA did their audit of the LSA manufacturers. Flight Design was one of the few who was following the rules and had minimal or no issues. Just because others are doing it doesn't mean it is right, and that audit was case in point.

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FD wasn't the only one who passed their audit.  TL-Ultralight passed the audit and is one of the manufacturers that doesn't lock down the Skyview.  

 

I'm going to bet that FD didn't replicate the Rotax manual and service instructions but simply defers to Rotax.  They could do they same with Dynon.  FD has made a choice for their product but blaming it on the ASTM doesn't hold water.

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Again, just relaying what I was told by someone who is familiar with the standards. Since I am not willing to pay for a copy of the standards I have no firsthand knowledge of what they require, that is why I rely on information from those who were evolved with developing the standards. Maybe you could share your copy of the standards giving me a better chance to research what is truely required.

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Flight Design allegedly restricts the screens arbitrary due to their notion of safety.  They do not want the PFD for example to be split into three segments because they think it will make the screen too confusing.  They also want the PFD to remain on the left side in front of the PIC.

 

Here is a 3 way split:

post-940-0-71272100-1446478011_thumb.jpg

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The biggest part of the standard is that engine instrumentation must be displayed at all times.

When I start the CTLSi and turn on the master avionics switch, there are no engine gauges visible without selecting something on one of the screen's.  This was one of the complaints to FD USA that they passed to Germany 2 years ago.

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Hi Everyone,

I realize this thread is old, but of concern to me.  This week I bought a 2014 CTLSi and learned that I cannot upgrade the software in the Skyview screens.  I'm stuck in version 6.  

Have any of you figured out how to crack this code to allow updating the software?

 

Regards,

     Ron

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Talk to flight design, because the current version is 11 something if I recall. They will give you upgrade files.

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Arian will get you fixed up. I think that you will need to update to 6.2 before you can get to 11.

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Arian at Flight Design is trying to help me with this.  He has sent me two sets of Unlock codes but neither will work, so far.  We'll try again next week.  Since we need at least version 14.xx to be 2020 compliant something would appear to have to be done in the near future.

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Eric,

What Arian sent me were two <1kb files with each serial number embedded.  Tried this twice and neither set of files worked.  Haven't heard from him this week.

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My bird (2015 CTLSi delivered in 2016, and upgraded to ADSB 2020 in mid 2016 when the Rotax Stator SB was being done) is ADSB 2020 compliant and as of a week ago is running v15.2.  When it boots, it still shows the Dynon boot screen in conjunction with the Flight Design logo, and the screen configuration is still limited (as it always has been with FD).  Just responding to let you know it is in fact possible.  I remember when CPS upgraded my Antenna (the only part required) that there were some calls between the mechanic, Dynon and FD to figure out how to update the files.   I'm wondering if you have called Dynon support? 

 

Now - My Soapbox Mini Rant:

The reason why FD GMBH refuses to unlock the Skyview remains a mystery to me.  Why they seem to think it must be locked down when other LSA manufacturers don't is beyond me.  Seems to me it would be "one less thing" to focus on in Germany.  The FD POH just needs to say "refer to the latest Skyview operating guide".  Perhaps one day... 

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Hmmm, another reason to go E-LSA. But I'm with you Adam, This appears to be a bridge too far in configuration control. It really smacks of the old Part 23 problem that enshrines ancient equipment, turning airplanes into museums.

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Ron, this file worked for me.  I upgraded myself to v 14 last year which got a little complicated because one screen had just come back from Dynon and had different version of Skyview than the other.  Got it figured out with great support from Dynon.   Arian has always been a huge help to me.  Hope this helps.

CTLSi_Masterunlock_11.1.duc

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And just looked at my 6.2 unlock files, they seemed specific to screen (PFD and EMS) and serial number.  That wasn't the case on 11.1 unlock file.

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Thanks very much, Paul.  I agree, Arian is a big help.  I've got it straightened out now and loaded v15.2.

  • Upvote 1

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