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j0nathan225

Can a B-Cool fit in a CTLS?

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Probably in the passenger seat, but not if you have a passenger.  It could possibly fit in a baggage bay with the fabric partition removed and the air blowing out behind the seat.  But I don't think you could get it through the baggage door, you'd have to remove a seat to get it back there.  You should definitely measure before ordering!  Also, it's 10lb empty, which probably means 30lb or more when full.

I've been flying my CTSW in hot, sticky Georgia for four years, and I have never felt an AC unit is a "must have".  Sure you sweat, but that is part of the "charm".   :D  

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cdarza   

I have always been tempted to get one of these contraptions.   But after borrowing one and trying one out in a 172, which did cool the cabin mind you,  it just wasn't worth the effort and cost.   Don't forget you gotta either bring some ice from home or go purchase ice everytime you use it.   Run time  is also not that long.   If you keep it ON continuous,  it might last 30 mins before all the ice melts.   Now you are just carrying useless water weight.     So, just keep the doors open on the ground and enjoy the big fan infront of you and once airborne - climb  as quick as you can to the cooler temps :)

 

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Adam   

For the first time in 9 years, just a few days ago I taxied with the pilot side door open (after removing the maps from the door pocket of course).  I have to say, I was amazed at the difference.   I'm sold...   no more closed door on a hot day!  I too had considered a B-Cool...   Not anymore!

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2 hours ago, Adam said:

For the first time in 9 years, just a few days ago I taxied with the pilot side door open (after removing the maps from the door pocket of course).  I have to say, I was amazed at the difference.   I'm sold...   no more closed door on a hot day!  I too had considered a B-Cool...   Not anymore!

Wow, have you been missing out!  The "egg" really collects heat on a sunny day.  I only wish I could open the doors in flight.

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18 minutes ago, FlyingMonkey said:

Wow, have you been missing out!  The "egg" really collects heat on a sunny day.  I only wish I could open the doors in flight.

That's another good question is the CT capable of doors off? The Valor 22 I flew was, never tried it though. My B-cool is a sunk cost at this point, I have used it 2x in the 172 I rent with fairly good results. Looking at the 2008+ CTs it APPEARS that it could sit on that shelf behind the pilot or copilot, but may be tight.  

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3 minutes ago, j0nathan225 said:

That's another good question is the CT capable of doors off? The Valor 22 I flew was, never tried it though. My B-cool is a sunk cost at this point, I have used it 2x in the 172 I rent with fairly good results. Looking at the 2008+ CTs it APPEARS that it could sit on that shelf behind the pilot or copilot, but may be tight.  

It has been done, but is not recommended nor approved by the factory.  Speed has to stay low, under 70-80kts, and it compromises the crash structure of the cabin because the doors complete the "egg" shape and provide rigidity.

Since I have an E-LSA I might try it at some point, but the downsides seem to outweigh the benefits.  

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Adam   
5 hours ago, FlyingMonkey said:

It has been done, but is not recommended nor approved by the factory.  Speed has to stay low, under 70-80kts, and it compromises the crash structure of the cabin because the doors complete the "egg" shape and provide rigidity.

Since I have an E-LSA I might try it at some point, but the downsides seem to outweigh the benefits.  

I think on an E-LSA version, a compromise could simply be a larger window in the Plexiglas (with larger fold out vent).   Keep the door closed but have a larger airflow capture.  Once upon a time you could get a photography window that was much larger.  Seems with the door staying shut, you have room to play with the window area.

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9 hours ago, Adam said:

For the first time in 9 years, just a few days ago I taxied with the pilot side door open (after removing the maps from the door pocket of course).  I have to say, I was amazed at the difference.   I'm sold...   no more closed door on a hot day!  I too had considered a B-Cool...   Not anymore!

Lost all my maps first day, even in Mammoth need to open the door.

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2 hours ago, Adam said:

I think on an E-LSA version, a compromise could simply be a larger window in the Plexiglas (with larger fold out vent).   Keep the door closed but have a larger airflow capture.  Once upon a time you could get a photography window that was much larger.  Seems with the door staying shut, you have room to play with the window area.

Yeah, I have toyed with the idea of a "patrol" door made entirely of plexi, or even a jeep-style "half door" with a frame and no windows installed.  These grand ideas are limited only by my lack of motivation to fabricate parts when I could be flying instead.

BTW, if anybody has some CTSW doors for sale from a wrecked airframe or some such that I could experiment on, I'd be interested.

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We never taxi in Tucson with closed doors except on a cold winter morning. It dos not hut the CT to taxi with doors open.

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BTW, to my shame some distractions did lead me to take off with my door wide open a couple of weeks ago.  The airplane flew and climbed normally up through about 65kt until I could reach out and close it.  No excessive vibration or shaking in either the door or airframe, it was just a little louder.  I really wish I could fly with the doors open!

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23 hours ago, FlyingMonkey said:

It has been done, but is not recommended nor approved by the factory.  Speed has to stay low, under 70-80kts, and it compromises the crash structure of the cabin because the doors complete the "egg" shape and provide rigidity.

Since I have an E-LSA I might try it at some point, but the downsides seem to outweigh the benefits.  

Your above statement is not exactly true. The airplanes were avaiable with removable hinge pins from the factory for the sole purpose of flying with the doors removed. It wasn't until the FAA saw someone flying in the evening with the doors removed at a major flyin that the practice was stopped. Since it has not been tested and spcifically approved for flights with the doors removed the FAA's stance is that you can't do it. The factory chose not to do the required flight testing and changes to the AOI's.

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Just now, Tom Baker said:

Your above statement is not exactly true. The airplanes were avaiable with removable hinge pins from the factory for the sole purpose of flying with the doors removed. It wasn't until the FAA saw someone flying in the evening with the doors removed at a major flyin that the practice was stopped. Since it has not been tested and spcifically approved for flights with the doors removed the FAA's stance is that you can't do it. The factory chose not to do the required flight testing and changes to the AOI's.

Oh, thanks for that insight!  My doors have the removable pins.  Since my airplane is E-LSA, it seems I could conduct my own flight testing. :)

I'm worried less about how the airplane might fly, since I know others have done it, and am more concerned about reduced crash protection and structural integrity.  I heard the original guidance was "speeds below 90kt", but that those who've done it have said 70kt is a better practical limit due to wind and buffeting.

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Anticept   

It's pretty easy to work on acrylic, Morden. Just use the proper tools. Treat it like cutting concrete, use water to keep it cool and lubricated, and cut slowly with an abrasive wheel. Don't leave sharp corners or cracks will start from them.

 

Use drillbits with a 60 degree included angle. Generally, the softer the material, the lower the included angle you want to use.

When drilling, make sure you have a solid grip, and drill with only the weight of the drill. Do not push or you will crack it. A meduim speed is good. Too low and it will grab. Too high and it will burn.

before you punch through completely, start drilling from the other side. This prevents the all too familiar problem of drill bits grabbing on the way out and chipping.

You can practice on sheets of acrylic or plexiglass from your local hardware store.

one last thing: the side windows are curved. The larger the window, the higher chance you will not be able to get it to fit.

Look up photo windows for gliders. Wings and wheels have some.

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Be advised that an enlarged window without a lock allows others to put their entire upper bodies in your cockpit even if you lock the doors.

I know of one professional photog that has a customized window with large opening, now that I have a super wide angle lens I would like one too.

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I purchased a B-Cool and put it in my Tecnam P2008.  It's way too tall to fit on the hat rack in the CT plus the slope of the roof line is a problem. As to in the passenger seat - I don't think it would work.  It's wider than my P2008 seats when in the luggage area and if it was turned sideways on the seat it would interfere with using the stick.  Given what I know about the CT, I don't think it is possible to put it in the baggage compartment.  However, next time I'm in Florida with my plane I'll try catch up with a couple CT guys I know and experiment.  But don't hold your breath, I won't be back until November and the need for cooling will be past.

The remark on how long the ice lasts is incorrect, it lasts at least two hours of running.  I flew from Moline to the Atlanta area earlier this summer (~5hrs) in over 90 degree weather and parked it overnight.  Typically you run it during the initial startup->climb to altitude and then it's cool enough to turn it off - until you descend and run in on approach and taxi.  The next morning I came out to the plane to put in new ice and it there was ice still floating in the cooler!  It works amazingly well and i would highly recommend it.

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rtk   

I have the B-Kool unit also.  I know it won't work in a Remos, and suspected it wouldn't work in the CT.  I have a SportCruiser and it will work in the luggage area behind the seats.  It works very well and, with the 12v sealed battery, I don't worry about over-drawing power from the plane.

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