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sandpiper

LSA rules changing??

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I am hearing reports from people returning from AirVenture that LSA rules are in the process of being changed. Won't be effective for two years.

Weights will go up, increase in stall speeds, in cockpit adjustable props, max airspeed to be increased, etc.

Does anyone have more information about this and how it may effect existing LSA such as our CT's??

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9 minutes ago, sandpiper said:

I am hearing reports from people returning from AirVenture that LSA rules are in the process of being changed. Won't be effective for two years.

Weights will go up, increase in stall speeds, in cockpit adjustable props, max airspeed to be increased, etc.

Does anyone have more information about this and how it may effect existing LSA such as our CT's??

I will make one comment John,

My CTSW's speed and complexity are basically fixed, unless I turbo this sucker  For now I don't care much. 

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Maybe we could get -12 flaps with a couple of minor modifications.  Ten extra knots (??) at cruise would be lovely. 

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50 minutes ago, John Vance said:

Maybe we could get -12 flaps with a couple of minor modifications.  Ten extra knots (??) at cruise would be lovely. 

Do you think its worth ten?     I think WOT + 5,500 + -12  is worth 10 (above 7k)

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Higher legal gross weight would be nice. We already know the plane can handle it. 

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The definition of LSA is changing.  Your particular LSA will not change unless the manufacture chooses to change it's certification to the new limits.

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27 minutes ago, JohnnyBlackCT said:

The definition of LSA is changing.  Your particular LSA will not change unless the manufacture chooses to change it's certification to the new limits.

A friend who was there said he heard the same thing. Not sure how this would affect ELSA.

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Let’s hope FD does whatever it takes to increase gross weight limits for existing planes, when the opportunity arrives

 

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ELSA are in the experimental catergory, not light sport.  As such, any change is allowed as long as it doesn't take the airplane outside the light sport definition.

A "major change" such as a prop or engine change requires testing by the owner and notification of the FSDO.  I'm guessing a weight change will be considered a major change, but should be allowed since it won't take the airplane outside the (new) LSA definition.

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5 hours ago, FlyingMonkey said:

ELSA are in the experimental catergory, not light sport.  As such, any change is allowed as long as it doesn't take the airplane outside the light sport definition.

A "major change" such as a prop or engine change requires testing by the owner and notification of the FSDO.  I'm guessing a weight change will be considered a major change, but should be allowed since it won't take the airplane outside the (new) LSA definition.

more motivation to convert to ELSA

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1 hour ago, Ed Cesnalis said:

more motivation to convert to ELSA

Personally, I think the ELSA rules are the best deal in aviation right now. Do your own maintenance with a weekend 16 hour course (if you are so inclined), no LOA/MRA factory hassles or payments, and make whatever modifications you want*...it's great and I have never looked back. 

*As long as the modifications keep the airplane within LSA performance limits. 

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21 hours ago, Roger Lee said:

-12 won't get you anything better than -6. I know from 1500 hrs of -12 and on 6 planes.

I had always thought that the elimination of -12 for the American market was needed to comply with the 120 kt limit. Not so?

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58 minutes ago, John Vance said:

I had always thought that the elimination of -12 for the American market was needed to comply with the 120 kt limit. Not so?

I think its the stall speed

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It was stall,  but during a lot of testing with 4 CT's I found no noticeable difference between stall and or top speed. It just wasn't worth the change and at extreme altitudes -12 was a detriment. Remember to that the huge majority of you fly well under gross weight. My time with these Ct's were both with a normal sized single pilot and other times up to 1475 lbs.

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I'd be happy if they changed the stall speed requirement from 45KCAS with flaps up to 45KCAS with full flaps.  That would give the CTs a lot of room to be heavier and still make the stall speed requirement.  A 150/152 could probably make that number as well.

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I smell a new generation of LSA's with a Rotax 915iS Turbo powering them...  How exciting.  

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3 hours ago, Adam said:

I smell a new generation of LSA's with a Rotax 915iS Turbo powering them...  How exciting.  

Good point Adam, but for the money, I'd prefer the 180 hp Titan 340. I.e. Rans S-21 Outbound.

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Like my gramma used to say . . . "wish in one hand . . spit in the other . . guess which one fills up the fastest! . . 😀

I actually cleaned that up a little.

She was a real character . . a ship welder durinng WW2 and drove an "Indian" motorcycle.

God rest her soul.

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9 hours ago, sandpiper said:

I think that any weight increase in our CT's, should FD be so inclined, would be limited by the BRS. 

Keep in mind BRS makes chutes for 182's and Cirrus too.  Heavier plane, bigger chute.   Anyone see the recent story on LSA safety in Aviation Consumer?  (or Aviation Safety, can't remember which one).  Virtually half of the accidents in LSA's are loss of control on the runway during landing.  Article was not very kind to our CT's.  I'd like to see some weight given to improving the landing gear (in my opinion the weak spot in virtually all LSA's).  So - give me the 915iS Turbo for power, a bit stronger landing gear and John's requested slightly larger chute - throw in some Air Conditioning and I'm ready to write a check!  (ok, maybe I just need to put on my big boy pants and fly a big boy air plane). 

Fun to dream... 

One LSA "ready to go" to higher weights is the Tecnam P2008.  It's already a certified plane in the EU at that higher weight limit (P2008JC).  I suspect a few of the manufacturers are busy tinkering with new configurations as we speak.

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I'm guessing the BRS issue would just cause a higher descent rate.  Unless you *really* cranked up the weight, it would probably be acceptable.  Float planes at 1430lb use the same parachute...  

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10 hours ago, sandpiper said:

I think that any weight increase in our CT's, should FD be so inclined, would be limited by the BRS. 

Aw yes. You are right and a larger chute would require and new mount, space and certification. Won't happen.

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