Tying down in strong winds

[CTSleepy]

Howdy, 

I'm receiving my 2006 CTSW this week. Very excited and stressed too. One thing stressing me is that I called three major airports, all the FBOs, the flights schools, and skydiving schools,  around me and all their hangars are taken. My only option is to tie down in a covered spot while I do this couple month complicated process to hangar it at the big airport by me which includes ground school and an FBI check. I live in the southwest, today we had winds gusting to 75mph. I'm totally freaked out about tying down such a light aircraft in the windy sandy south. I bought the thicker slidedown tie downs because I'm horrible at knots. Anyone with experience or opinions about tying down this aircraft in these conditions? Thank you. 

[Roger Lee]

75 mph is a lot. What about taking it to another airport? Outside may be a little risky even if it's tied down.

[CTSleepy]

Hi Roger, 

I called the three airports within 100 miles of me. All their hangars are rented. I'm not excited at all about tying it down. 

[FlyingMonkey]

Can you delay taking possession of the airplane?  Waiting for more favorable conditions might be prudent.  If it's in a hangar with the current owner, maybe you could cut a deal to pay part or all of his hangar rent until you can take the airplane.

[CTSleepy]

Unfortunately it's that way all through the summer. Any tips for keeping it down is much appreciated. 

[Ed Cesnalis]

I was tied down at Lee Vining for a summer while our runway was replaced.  There was a long day, 80mph, blasted with pumice where I was tied down badly and my CT spent most of the day flying while tied down.  I had the stick held back with the seat belt.

That was many years ago, there was some damage to my windscreen from the pumice but its gone now.  I was lucky but this is possible.

[CTSleepy]

Thank you Ed. I'm worried but hopefully it won't be too bad. 

[Ed Cesnalis]

6 minutes ago, CTSleepy said:

Thank you Ed. I'm worried but hopefully it won't be too bad. 

I'm not saying its a good idea and there's no guarantee.   

[FlyingMonkey]

1 hour ago, CTSleepy said:

Unfortunately it's that way all through the summer. Any tips for keeping it down is much appreciated. 

You are expecting 75mph winds through the summer?  Or do you mean you have to take it now or wait until the end of the Summer?  I'd rather have a nice CT at the end of Summer than a balled up wreck now.  

EDIT:  I get it, you'd have to be in a covered tie down through the Summer.  Well, that would probably be okay in the Southwest, as long as you are not getting those high winds all the time.  But I still think you should wait if the winds are high now.  Might be best to hangar elsewhere through the Summer, even if it's 100 miles away.

[Tom Baker]

1 hour ago, Ed Cesnalis said:

I was tied down at Lee Vining for a summer while our runway was replaced.  There was a long day, 80mph, blasted with pumice where I was tied down badly and my CT spent most of the day flying while tied down.  I had the stick held back with the seat belt.

That was many years ago, there was some damage to my windscreen from the pumice but its gone now.  I was lucky but this is possible.

This is just a point worth mentioning. Having the control stick tied back is not the best choice, but it is better than nothing. Having the stick tied back allows wind to get under the tail trying to flip the airplane. A wind from the front the tail goes down increasing the angle of attack and the lift produced by the wing. If you can tie the stick forward, or at a minimum neutral to slightly forward. A wind from the rear will tend to keep the airplane planted on the ground. A wind from the front will raise the tail causing the wings to dump lift.

25 years ago I was able to talk with some light airplane salesmen that worked after WW2. They would land in farmers fields to demonstrate airplanes. If they had to weather out a storm they would tie the controls forward, but often the airplanes were not tied down. They said the airplanes would turn into the wind, and for the most part stay put. At worst they might get pushed back against a fence row.

Edited to add, If you can get covers with a built in spoilers to keep the wings from producing lift it might be worth the money.

[CTSleepy]

So tie it forward if I need to? It'll be tied down well so it won't be able to weather vane but it sounds like it will help out. Thanks for your advice. 

[FlyingMonkey]

It's easy to get a short bungee and attach to the stick and around the rudder pedal bar.  You might need a bundle of rubber bands or a hose clamp on the stick below the bungee hook to keep it from sliding down on the stick.  This is what I have used for years as a gust lock.

[sandpiper]

Spoilers as Tom mentioned. Either as part of wing covers or individually strapped down "rolls". I have seen both ways. I have even seen people strap on two by fours. Anything to kill the lift.

[Towner]

What would be a reasonable max wind speed for tying down outside? I’m looking at flying to Henderson NV (KHND) and returning Monday. When I last checked, they are expecting high winds Friday and Saturday with gusts up to 44 knots.

[Anticept]

44 is a lot. But it should hold. Flaps full up as far as you can get them.

Line it up carefully, and don't put slack in the lines, this is what shockloads the tie down rings and such when it moves around. Ropes should be straight with some tension, but without lifting the nose. Move the tail around after tying to make sure the ropes don't go slack. Most commonly this happens because people tie down the airplane with the wings over the tie down rings... park it so that the tie down rings are slightly in front of the wings. The tail and the wing tie downs need to work against each other for the most security.

And as was mentioned, the stick needs to be tied forward and in the neutral aileron position.

[Towner]

Thanks Corey. I think I’ll give it a shot if the rest of the weather cooperates.

[Tom Baker]

More than tying down take into consideration the direction of the wind.  Preferably park into the wind. Second how to secure the controls.  Ailerons should be neutral, the stabilator should be neutral to slightly down. 

[Towner]

It looks like it’s gonna be a pretty strong cross wind for the parking position, which I don’t like. I got a spot under a shade to keep it dry in the rain. There are a group of hangers that may help block some of the wind for where I’d be parking , but I might just make a 6 hour drive instead.

[airhound]

My aero club closed down partially due to major damages to a fleet of 172s and 152s caused by micro bursts slamming the tails into the ground. They became uneconomically repairable. Even though some of the 172s have tie down stations/eye-bolts near the nose gear not sure if any ramps do. I think the bolts may have been originally intended to tie-down/move the aircraft by rail or truck. Perhaps micro bursts are a low probability to consider when building airport ramp tie-downs. Or, maybe nose tie-downs cause too much structural stress in windy conditions when all axis’s are tied down?

[Anticept]

He could put a tailstand under it if he's worried about that.

Reality is, microburts have potential to tear up any aircraft that isn't in a hangar. They are monstrously destructive.

[airhound]

Roger that, do you suppose that is why nose gear vicinity Ty downs and equivalent ramp anchor points have never been part of GA.

[Towner]

Well, the weather just isn’t going to let me fly myself, so it’s airline travel now. Still great information to have for the future. I’m always hangered at home and we really don’t get winds like that anyway, so great info for future travels.

[shiny.ice]

On 2/28/2024 at 1:41 PM, Anticept said:

44 is a lot. But it should hold.

Just happened across it, the ASTM spec says the tiedowns must be rated at least 38kts (20 m/s). I mean, precisely it says this:

Quote

5.11.1 Tie-Down Points— Tie-down points shall be designed for the maximum wind at which the airplane may be tied down in the open. VR = 20 m/s (38 kts) minimum as given in 5.3.7 may be used.

5.3.7 talks about the control surfaces/control system being able to handle "ground gust conditions".