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iaw4

technique in ctsw

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I know we have different perspectives on landing techniques on this forum.  different techniques are preferred by different people.  here is my own.  I hope it will help other newbies.

landing technique

  • pattern distance on downwind: about 0.75nm to runway
  • cut power abeam the numbers.  completely.  (on my airplane, idle us about 1800rpm.) all landings are basically power-off landings.
  • 15 degrees of flaps soon after, before turning base.
  • on base, speed will bleed to about 60 knots to about 500fpm descent rate
  • recommended for all airplanes: not one 90 degree turn to final, but two 45 degree turns to final.
  • side-slipping works, but not as well as in airplanes with a fatter side profile.  energy management is more important in a ctsw.
  • about 60 knots over the threshold
  • about 55 knots typical landing speed --- note: this is never really true slow flight until the very end.
  • keep eyes firmly on the ground through the left side window.  (in other planes, I look over the noise down to the runway end to judge altitude and continually hold off the airplane.  not in this one.)
  • just hold off the runway.  if too fast, you may flare twice.  power to smooth the flare is usually not necessary.  just keep your eyes firmly on the ground through the side window.  don't yank the stick, just fly the airplane with soft inputs.  the ctsw is very responsive even to very soft touch, esp in ground effect.
  • when wheels touch down, immediately relax the stick.  holding the stick back will make the airplane do bunny hops.  yes, the ctsw can fly at 40 knots!  if need be, very slight stick pressure forward to keep the airplane on the ground
  • 30 degree flaps or lower speeds are possible, but not necessary.

other observations

the CTSW is very light.  almost twitchy, halfway between an airplane and a helicopter.  this can be a problem for pilots coming from other airplanes.  it takes getting used to.  even after having gotten used to this, it is *very* difficult to be perfect on the speeds.  every little wind gust makes a difference and can throw the airplane off (or even around).  I live in a mountainous region, with constant sudden draft reversals and wind gusts.  the ctsw would have been a better airplane for my region if it had had less wing.  its wing loading is super-low.  I know the LSA requirement is 45 knots stall speed.  the FDCT could have sawed off some wing to up the stall speed in exchange for less sensitivity IMHO.

add one category on turbulence.  what is light chop for a standard 4-seater can easily become moderate turbulence for the ctsw.  I would not fly it into known moderate turbulence, which can become severe turbulence for a ctsw.

the airplane is also rudder sensitive.  some linkage to ailerons would have made it more pleasant.   the ctsw has more than enough control surface to deal with wind of any kind...as long as it is steady and expected.

(stalling the airplane is also more unpleasant because one really has to point the nose far towards the moon to make it happen.  it's hard to get a CTSW into a stall...heck, we ditzed around near-stall at what our speed indicator claimed was 35 knots airspeed.  of course, any wing gust near a stall is then double nasty.)

the ctsw is a wonderful fun flier.  however, it does require adjustment.  safe and easy for me to fly in normal weather, but not a good flier into known turbulence.

more other observations

the rotax powerplant is wonderful, but it overheats on the ground in hot weather.  (strangely, only two of my four cylinders.)  I updated to the lithium battery.  highly recommended.

the overhead window is stupid.  who wants to be fried by the sun?

the cockpit visibility and size is great.

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I noted you were anonymously "Downvoted", there are a few veterans on here who "own" the site at least in spirit and therefore your post has been completely dismissed without any challenge or argument.  So, off with your head and don't come back !  This forum is a "non-political site", yet sadly and often hugely political... God bless 'em. 

I am a new pilot and a new CT pilot and have made lots of landing mistakes, but I disagree with a couple of your tips... for example, and in no particular order:

The moderate Turbulence comment.  Went on a lunch run with a Bonanza, two Arrows and a Navion not too long ago.  Windy and turbulent.  It was one of my rip the bandaid off moments.  The way back (hour flight) was worse than the flight over, i.e. the wind picked up.  But, I was "fine"... meaning, the others complained about the turbulence big time, I wasn't uncomfortable at all... In my unscientific way, I think the -6 flaps choice shrinks the wing enough where the CT can fly with the old standbyes and hold its own.  

I am landing 99% of the time with 15 degs flaps and similar power settings as you described (my RPM's at idle are about 1,450, so a bit slower than yours).  Your method, except the "look at the runway" point, is sound except in crosswind or shear conditions which my airport is famous for.  I came in the other day, straight "enough" in a cross wind, with 15 degs flaps, and a low power setting and at the last minute I pushed the stick all the way to the left to my leg and couldn't go anymore, thankfully the plane straightened out... if the wind had picked up I would have been in trouble.  

I contacted my instructor and told him that him I need to work on less flaps, more power to attack the cross winds and shear conditions.  So, I am going to work on that.

Looking down the runway instead of to the ground has improved my landing finesse a ton.  I used to look at the runway instinctively and there was always that pop up at the end of my flair. 

My engine temps have been fine, however, I haven't flown in 90+ weather yet.  I love the roof window, it's great in the pattern turns and it's a good quick check to make certain a Cherokee or Cirrus didn't decide to land on top of me.  I tamed the sun with a static cling film, works great.  Managed to cover 99% of the window.

Finally, I end up with the stick in my lap... I "Stall" land... and when the plane's mains hit the ground I keep the stick back, and let the nose down gently.  Landings are going well, big improvement in Short Field... nothing more fun than a short field and 30 degs flaps landings... however, as noted above, I need a different technique for cross and shear.  More speed, more RPM's over the control surfaces.  

Thanks for posting.

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11 hours ago, iaw4 said:

 

I know we have different perspectives on landing techniques on this forum.  different techniques are preferred by different people.  here is my own.  I hope it will help other newbies.

landing technique

  • pattern distance on downwind: about 0.75nm to runway
  • cut power abeam the numbers.  completely.  (on my airplane, idle us about 1800rpm.) all landings are basically power-off landings.
  • 15 degrees of flaps soon after, before turning base.
  • on base, speed will bleed to about 60 knots to about 500fpm descent rate
  • recommended for all airplanes: not one 90 degree turn to final, but two 45 degree turns to final.
  • side-slipping works, but not as well as in airplanes with a fatter side profile.  energy management is more important in a ctsw.
  • about 60 knots over the threshold
  • about 55 knots typical landing speed --- note: this is never really true slow flight until the very end.
  • keep eyes firmly on the ground through the left side window.  (in other planes, I look over the noise down to the runway end to judge altitude and continually hold off the airplane.  not in this one.)
  • just hold off the runway.  if too fast, you may flare twice.  power to smooth the flare is usually not necessary.  just keep your eyes firmly on the ground through the side window.  don't yank the stick, just fly the airplane with soft inputs.  the ctsw is very responsive even to very soft touch, esp in ground effect.
  • when wheels touch down, immediately relax the stick.  holding the stick back will make the airplane do bunny hops.  yes, the ctsw can fly at 40 knots!  if need be, very slight stick pressure forward to keep the airplane on the ground
  • 30 degree flaps or lower speeds are possible, but not necessary.

other observations

the CTSW is very light.  almost twitchy, halfway between an airplane and a helicopter.  this can be a problem for pilots coming from other airplanes.  it takes getting used to.  even after having gotten used to this, it is *very* difficult to be perfect on the speeds.  every little wind gust makes a difference and can throw the airplane off (or even around).  I live in a mountainous region, with constant sudden draft reversals and wind gusts.  the ctsw would have been a better airplane for my region if it had had less wing.  its wing loading is super-low.  I know the LSA requirement is 45 knots stall speed.  the FDCT could have sawed off some wing to up the stall speed in exchange for less sensitivity IMHO.

add one category on turbulence.  what is light chop for a standard 4-seater can easily become moderate turbulence for the ctsw.  I would not fly it into known moderate turbulence, which can become severe turbulence for a ctsw.

the airplane is also rudder sensitive.  some linkage to ailerons would have made it more pleasant.   the ctsw has more than enough control surface to deal with wind of any kind...as long as it is steady and expected.

(stalling the airplane is also more unpleasant because one really has to point the nose far towards the moon to make it happen.  it's hard to get a CTSW into a stall...heck, we ditzed around near-stall at what our speed indicator claimed was 35 knots airspeed.  of course, any wing gust near a stall is then double nasty.)

the ctsw is a wonderful fun flier.  however, it does require adjustment.  safe and easy for me to fly in normal weather, but not a good flier into known turbulence.

more other observations

the rotax powerplant is wonderful, but it overheats on the ground in hot weather.  (strangely, only two of my four cylinders.)  I updated to the lithium battery.  highly recommended.

the overhead window is stupid.  who wants to be fried by the sun?

the cockpit visibility and size is great.

Thanks for the write up, I have a few of comments:

*  If you have to release stick back pressure after touchdown to prevent going back into the air ("bunny hop"), you are likely landing too fast.  You mention a 15¯ flaps approach over the fence at 60kt and landing at 55kt.  My touchdown speed is about 45kt in that configuration, if you are actually touching down at 55kt you are too fast.  You should never need even slight forward stick to hold the airplane on the ground.  You should be able to hold the stick back after contact without issue, and in fact I'd say it's critical to protect the nose gear, especially if you ever land on grass.

* I judge my altitude out the windshield, instead of using the side window as you mention.  Why do you do that in other airplane, but not the CT?

* In low winds, I make almost all my landings at 30° flaps.  The approach and touchdown are much slower, and you can make your approach down to 48-50kt.  This makes for really gentle, short landings with minimal roll out.  above 8kt wind speed or in significant crosswinds the 15° flaps setting is a lot easier.

* Agreed on turbulence, you will get kicked around quite a bit if it's significant.  I will say that once you slow down a bit and accept that it's going to be a bumpy ride, the CT does handle it okay.  The human beings are the weak link here!  😄

* I'm surprised you don't like the CT stall characteristics.  IMO the CT is docile to the point of being boring.  A full stall is hard to do, the airplane just mushes along and bobs at about a 800-1000fpm descent rate at 35-40kt.  If you snatch the stick back quickly close to stall speed you can make it break and get the  nose to drop, but it's a non-event and the airplane is instantly flying again as soon as you release the stick pressure.  It's hard for me to get a wing drop out of the CT, I've only done it once while aggressively trying to provoke it.

* The CT slips like a champ!  You do have to use stick back pressure while slipping to hold the nose up, or the airplane will pick up a lot of speed and the descent rate will not be great.  The local flight instructors report the same behavior with the Diamond DA-20s they  fly.  If you peg the rudder and pick up the nose to hold your speed around 50kt with 30° flaps, you can generate impressive descent rates.  I like to come in on the high side and adjust the glide slope by slipping; it's my standard technique and I end up in some degree of slip for 50-60% of my landings.

* I have never had ground overheating problems with my Rotax even in Georgia Summer...what temps are you seeing? 

* The "stupid overhead window is great for seeing into a steep turn, I use it a lot.  It does put some heat on your noggin though.      

 

I'd also like to briefly address the "politics" of this forum.  I have been here for several years, and my experience is that this is one of the *least* political forums I have been on.  Folks here really want to learn, share experiences, and talk about these wonderful little airplanes.  Like all pilots we certainly love our debates on aerodynamics, technique, and every other damn thing, but in the end we all respect the other pilots here and just want to enjoy the discussions.  

A while back a forum update allowed "upvotes" and "downvotes" of posts.  I didn't even notice the change until AGLyme got downvoted on a post and made a stink about it.  Ever since then he's been promoting a conspiracy theory that there is some small group of user here that control things through downvoting the pilots they don't like.  It just isn't true.

Let's be clear:  Downvoting means NOTHING.  Upvoting means NOTHING. It's just some aspect of the forum software that allows users to register an opinion about a post.  As we all know, opinions are like butts -- everybody has one and they all stink.  Ignore them.  As an illustration, I will downvote this post, and upvote AGLyme's post.  Who cares? Don't let your ego be so fragile that somebody else's anonymous opinion of a post throws you into a mental tailspin.

EDIT:  turns out you can't vote up or down on your own posts.  Oh well, I tried.  I encourage others to downvote the hell out of this post.

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12 hours ago, iaw4 said:

 

  • when wheels touch down, immediately relax the stick.  holding the stick back will make the airplane do bunny hops.  yes, the ctsw can fly at 40 knots!  if need be, very slight stick pressure forward to keep the airplane on the ground

As an experienced flight instructor with time (1,000 plus) in both CTSW and CTLS, this is bad advice. What you are advocating is a recipe for loss of directional control. It also leads to undo wear on the nose gear leading to nose wheel shimmy.

I am an advocate of using 15° flaps in most situations, but I want the aircraft held off the ground to near stall speed, and continue to hold the stick aft. What I tell students is that you want to get the airplane as close to the ground as you can without touching, and then hold it off the ground as long as you can.

Also it is hard to maintain longitudinal alignment without looking out the front and down the runway, even then alignment is difficult for some.

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I do the majority of my landings with my stick full aft.  I keep my noseweel up as long as I can.

3 wheels on the runway too early leaves you vulnerable to gusts.  Even 2 wheels 2 early isn't good.

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Tried to send a private message Andy (Monkey), but you "aren't accepting messages".  Please stop downvoting and the hating man, the CT world is too small and this site actually is highly political according to several who have contacted me.  Anonymous downvoting is for teenagers on socializing sites and nerds who got beat up as kids... Debate is healthy and we all learn.  Downvoting serves to get rid of people...

I am accepting private messages so let's take the debate offline where it belongs.  Thanks, Andrew

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1 hour ago, AGLyme said:

Tried to send a private message Andy (Monkey), but you "aren't accepting messages".  Please stop downvoting and the hating man, the CT world is too small and this site actually is highly political according to several who have contacted me.  Anonymous downvoting is for teenagers on socializing sites and nerds who got beat up as kids... Debate is healthy and we all learn.  Downvoting serves to get rid of people...

I am accepting private messages so let's take the debate offline where it belongs.  Thanks, Andrew

What in the world are you talking about?  I have never downvoted a post of yours.  I don't think I've ever downvoted a post of anyone's.  If I'm not accepting private messages then there is a setting somewhere I'm not aware of, or my inbox is full.

This is getting weird.

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Adults Anonymously downvoting is weird Sport.   Take it offline Andy... unlock your mail please.

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2 minutes ago, AGLyme said:

...  Take it offline Andy... 

Shouldn't everyone benefit from your thinking on how to fly a CTSW?

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1,000 landings in my 06 CTSW did not prepare me well for landing my 07 CTSW.  I went from stick and rudder without (or only minimal) centering springs to a new much heavier feel on all 3 axis.

I don't mind it at all in the mornings but as the thermals start exploding and ruining the smooth air I find the feel foreign and lacking authority.   Its going to take me 50 landings to get my comfort back.  This was totally unexpected.

As I go back to pattern work my basics are the same.  I cut power abeam and coast in using 30* indicating 55 and land with stick full aft and nose wheel up and balanced to stay there for a bit.

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Not “mad”, disappointed... at least everyone now knows who the mad downvoter is... 

the lady doth protest too much...

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21 minutes ago, AGLyme said:

Not “mad”, disappointed... at least everyone now knows who the mad downvoter is... 

the lady doth protest too much...

You are being ridiculous.  I have told you in three different threads that I have never downvoted you.  Every time you bring it up I try to talk you off the ledge and point out that the whole downvote thing makes no difference to anything.  Still you persist, and now you want to accuse me.  No good deed goes unpunished I guess.

You are poisoning this forum with your kooky conspiracy talk, and frankly you sound like a paranoid narcissist. You sure are making me WANT to downvote you.  I guess I'll just put you on ignore instead.

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3 hours ago, Ed Cesnalis said:

1,000 landings in my 06 CTSW did not prepare me well for landing my 07 CTSW.  I went from stick and rudder without (or only minimal) centering springs to a new much heavier feel on all 3 axis.

I don't mind it at all in the mornings but as the thermals start exploding and ruining the smooth air I find the feel foreign and lacking authority.   Its going to take me 50 landings to get my comfort back.  This was totally unexpected.

As I go back to pattern work my basics are the same.  I cut power abeam and coast in using 30* indicating 55 and land with stick full aft and nose wheel up and balanced to stay there for a bit.

Ed, you make a point in this post that most everyone seems to miss. These airplane all have individual personalities. Your old CTSW is different than your new one. CTSW's are different than CTLS's. What works for one person and their airplane might not work well for someone else and theirs.

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I think folks have had it with this public baloney.  Stop the hating Monkey and live up to your own policies of name calling and politics.  If you and others want to humiliate people that’s your prerogative I suppose, I’m (and many others who are wisely avoiding this posting) saying it’s juvenile and harmful.

All I have tried to accomplish is to pay forward and give back with my newbie flying and CT experiences.  Based on private feedback, most of my posts were appreciated. You crossed the line too many times got called out by me and you went political.  

At the end of the day it’s your sandbox, posting here is no longer enjoyable and you and Ed have your wish.  I will only post when I see you, Ed or anyone else downvote some poor downvotee who wants to share his/her experience with the CT.

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4 minutes ago, AGLyme said:

I think folks have had it with this public baloney.  Stop the hating Monkey and live up to your own policies of name calling and politics.  If you and others want to humiliate people that’s your prerogative I suppose, I’m (and many others who are wisely avoiding this posting) saying it’s juvenile and harmful.

All I have tried to accomplish is to pay forward and give back with my newbie flying and CT experiences.  Based on private feedback, most of my posts were appreciated. You crossed the line too many times got called out by me and you went political.  

At the end of the day it’s your sandbox, posting here is no longer enjoyable and you and Ed have your wish.  I will only post when I see you, Ed or anyone else downvote some poor downvotee who wants to share his/her experience with the CT.

Dude,  its all good, just chill.   Maybe you should just take people at their word and not assume.  You are assuming I have some kind of wish but your wrong.

Even if you and I cannot agree its still all good, no need for drama at all.

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an airplane can be landed in many ways.  it can be slipped down from pattern altitude, it can be landed all the way from 1000' in stall or near-stall.  it can be flown at 45 knots and landed in full stall.  it can be flow in slow flight all the way.  all good (or better).

BUT there are some advantages to my method.  I would argue that they are more forgiving FOR ME.  They trade off some extra wear for some extra safety margin.  here is what I mean:

  • the advantage is that my technique maintains full ordinary flight control all the way down to the runway.  the wind is my friend. my prop makes it.  in general, lesser-flap and faster landings are less sensitive to gusts from random directions.  after touchdown, I have the two ground wheels plus the rudder for lateral control.  most important, if a sudden downshear pushes me down before the runway (and we have a few trees right in front of our threshold!), then I can quickly trade speed for altitude.  together with the fast rotax spoolup, I am out of trouble in no time.
  • the disadvantage of my method is that it is unsuitable to short (and soft) airports.  I land fast and long.  note that my technique does not put more stress on the wheel struts or on the front wheel.  I don't push down the controls down to put stress on my front wheel.  if it appears as if the airplane wants to hop, I just relax the stick.   can hopping be avoided with slower landings?  yes!  landing fast puts a little more wear on the tire, but these tires are used in planes landing much faster than the ctsw.

my method is also suitable for eventual pilot adjustment into slower landing speeds.  my plan is to land slower and slower over time, by holding it off longer just before touchdown.  I don't want to be slower over the threshold.  it will still be for long runways only.

it is safer to fly a little too high and fast than too low and slow.   if you are never at risk for the latter, then yes, you are perfect.  for me, the penalty function is very asymmetric here. 

for the same reason, I am not fond of sideslips with the nose up...uncoordinated airplane with steep angle of attack?!  if you are good at it, great.  but if you or your student makes a mistake here, near the ground, you have a lot to lose.  I don't mind sideslips with the nose down.  but it is those sideslips that are not as effective in CTSWs as they are in other airplanes.

PS: part of my description was wrong.  I am not looking out the side-window.  I am looking out the front window, but diagonal left corner thereof, towards the lower part of the mushroom.  somehow, it helps me understand the sensitivity and instantaneity of the ctsw inputs more.  when I used my "other airplane" technique of looking over the nose and out the window, I was more tempted to yank the stick than to do just the many delicate adjustments that I now use to keep the airplane just off the ground.  not sure why.  just works like this for me.  I also still have near perfect lateral direction now.  came automatically.  (not at the start of my flying, but now.)

(CTSW stall characteristics are indeed fine.  not what I meant.  what I meant is that I like to see what's ahead, and not point up 45 degrees.)

 

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24 minutes ago, iaw4 said:

an airplane can be landed in many ways.  it can be ...

You are overthinking it.  Lean by feel too.

 

1.3 x Vso  is safe right?  30% above stall  is safe so even more is even more safe right?

Your increased speed doesn't enhance safety instead it ads risk.  Limiting speed limits energy and increasing it increases energy in a dramatic fashion.  Increased energy is where the risk is.

When it comes to gusty landings there is a vulnerable speed. Your fast landings has you slowing through the vulnerable speed zone with too many wheels on the runway.  You cannot counter a tailwind quartering gust with gear on the runway and flying speed.  You can however counter the same gust at the same speed if you had zero or only one main in contact. Far better to bleed off your flying speed then land.

1) increased energy, 2) directional control if gusted when fast on the ground.  These are the 2 flaws in your technique but guess what?  Most CT pilots prefer too fast.

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well, I fly 1.35 x Vso, so I am not far off from 1.3 x Vso.  bob hoover loved to fly along runways at full speed with one wheel kissing the ground.  I am no bob hoover.

I want the extra energy until I am practically over the runway.  safety margin.  ok, agreed, then it may actually no longer be a benefit, but a cost.

in principle, I should be able to bleed off speed from 55 down to 45 on long enough runways while flying along the runway.  (any guess how much runway this slowing will take?) on my own home runway, this means that I have already left the "approach trees" behind me and I am no longer subject to the mountain gust and windshear surrounding my airport (but not the runway).

and, eventually, I will probably work my way down with 55 over threshold, 50 on landing zone, and 45 wheels down.  yes, still fast.

ed---where can I read up more about "vulnerable speed zones" while flying?  I have never heard of this before.

 

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15 minutes ago, iaw4 said:

ed---where can I read up more about "vulnerable speed zones" while flying?  I have never heard of this before.

I don't know, talk to old pilots maybe.

To be clear,   1 vulnerable speed zone and it applies to the landing sequence (and takeoff).

Its most likely that we experience this vulnerable zone on take off.  A crosswind take off in a CT is best done with a higher rotation speed so when you come off its abrupt.  When we do this slowly, nose wheel first we likely begin skidding sideways on our mains towards the downwind runway edge.  There is no good way to counter this, luckily it seldom lasts long and we just fly away (but not from the center line).

Think about getting mains and nose wheel on the runway at 55kts.  With16kts above flying speed a rouge gust could teach you that it has more control over your plane than you do.  Sideways skipping, wheel barrowing, tail or upwind wing lifting, ...   you are left with 2 choices, brake or throttle and they both kinda suck.  The brake can make things worse and the throttle is no longer a simple instant answer because you are no longer in the air.

 

Thanks for asking. 

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thx, ed.  I just want to learn.

overthinking it again, I should conclude that faster speed is a tradeoff.  in windier and gustier weather, extra energy adds safety above/before the runway but costs safety just after touchdown, especially with respect to quartering or uplifting tailwind gusts on the runway.  although the optimal tradeoff solution can vary with pilot skill, these are the main safety-related issues on long runways.  in thinking about the tradeoff, consider also:

  1. too little energy before landing can be catastrophic for plane and pilot;  too much energy after landing can be catastrophic but more likely just for the plane.
  2. tailwind gusts seem rare.  usually, my gusts have come from roughly the same direction as the wind (ie, from the front, but up to quartering from left, right, above, and below).  (Q: in what types of airports and weather condition should I expect to encounter significant tailwind gusts?)
  3. my technique critically depends on lots of runway available.  it also leaves me less prepared for short strip and emergency landings.
  4. as specific pilot skill increases, I may want to reduce fast low-flap landings from about 1.4 x Vso to about 1.30 x Vso over the threshold, and from 1.35 to 1.20 (or lower) on touchdown.

good summary?  anything else I am missing?

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4 hours ago, iaw4 said:

 

well, I fly 1.35 x Vso, so I am not far off from 1.3 x Vso.  bob hoover loved to fly along runways at full speed with one wheel kissing the ground.  I am no bob hoover.

You can touch wheels to the ground at almost any speed an airplane will fly. However Bob Hoover was much slower than full speed when he would touch with one wheel. If you watch old videos of Bob flying he has flaps down most of the time he is doing the one wheel landings.

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Yeah, anytime I end up pushing my stick to “stick” the landing, it was a bad approach in the first place, as FlyingMonkey mentions, pretty much always being too fast ... Whenever this happens ( thankfully , pretty much once in a blue moon these days ) I really hate myself for doing that because there may be that one day when , after enough abuse, the front wheel will just keep going and won’t stop 🙂 - potentially very costly habit .

 

 

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7 hours ago, AGLyme said:

I think folks have had it with this public baloney.  Stop the hating Monkey and live up to your own policies of name calling and politics.  If you and others want to humiliate people that’s your prerogative I suppose, I’m (and many others who are wisely avoiding this posting) saying it’s juvenile and harmful.

All I have tried to accomplish is to pay forward and give back with my newbie flying and CT experiences.  Based on private feedback, most of my posts were appreciated. You crossed the line too many times got called out by me and you went political.  

At the end of the day it’s your sandbox, posting here is no longer enjoyable and you and Ed have your wish.  I will only post when I see you, Ed or anyone else downvote some poor downvotee who wants to share his/her experience with the CT.

Not enough CT talk on this forum. In the weeks since I started stalking the forum, some serious percentage of posts are indeed about “downvoting”. So I downvoted just now, right now. And maybe now all those posts about “downvoting” are slightly less silly and slightly more relevant. But only slightly. Admins: please discourage petty whining. Let’s get back to CT talk. I want real world advice on how overweight is too overweight and what sort of performance benefit one would see from going ELSA and adding a constant speed prop? And what about -12 degree flaps, anyone know how to do that? Downvotes...shoot me.

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