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2006 CTsw IFR? E-LSA?


CTSleepy

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Morning.

I LOVE my CTsw. It's just so easy to fly. So I'd like to keep it longer.

Could I convert my S-LSA 2006 CTsw to E-LSA for IFR? Has anyone done this? I'm getting a quote for new panels on it. Will the plane lose value? Would there have to be a checkout period like other E-LSAs? Just wondering what are the pros and cons of doing so and anyone's experience.

Edit: Also, anyone have a rough quote on what they paid for their panels?

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Look at the operating limitations that go with the airworthiness certificate. They may allow IFR flight without converting to ELSA. The prohibition of IFR flight in a SLSA didn't go into effect until 2010. That being said I would be very cautious about flying in actual IMC. There was at least one incident of a CTSW early on where the engine quit during IFR cruising because the fuel vents iced up. It may have happened twice. This was part of the reason for the prohibition, and it was pushed by the FAA.

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Hi Tom. I will probably have to convert to a E-LSA anyway just to put those panels in. I have a 696/no VOR and it doesn't have the necessary equipment for IFR. The reason I'm thinking of doing it is that I found myself pinched between a cloud layer and the mountain when doing a cross country in the summer. Plenty of sky above me but couldn't really take advantage of it. I would definitely not go into icing conditions. I would like to avoid the occasional cloudy day cancelling part of my trip. 

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  • 1 month later...

I've done some digging on this exact subject.  I have a 2005 and do not have the IFR/IMC limitation so I continued to dig deeper.  I have found no issues getting any of the radios and GPS units approved.  The one issue I found as a block is a headed pitot for us CTs with the Boom style pitot, I know it's not required by the regs, but it does add peace of mind.  My reason for the move is to get my CT up to par as an IFR trainer so I can start work on my rating.  My use in IMC is similar as I wouldn't consider flying in storms/winter weather, but instead would love to punch through the usual summer marine layer along the California coast.

Regarding the pitot, I have found 1 company that manufactures heated pitots for military drones.  They have a option that can be made to order and would fit into the existing pitot hole/location.  I'll admit I'm scared to ask the cost, and also don't think I can get a MRA from FDUSA.

My 2 cents....

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It really depends on what limitations the DAR who signs off your conversion is willing to write.  My E-LSA operating limitations allow IFR flight if the aircraft is properly equipped.  If my airplane had all the gear listed in the FARs as required for IFR flights, it would be legal to fly it IFR.  Of course you'd want to stay way from anything resembling known icing conditions, and the composite structure has no way to implement lightning strike protection.  You could fly it light IFR where the primary issues are visibility and ceilings.  

If this is a requirement for you, then you definitely want to discuss it with the DAR before the inspection takes place. 

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The inspection and talking to the DAR is a great idea. I got a quote for about $11k for the conversion of equipment. The custom pitot is a great find. Weighing the pros and cons of conversion. My newest insurance said they didn't care if I converted to experimental, the quote would be the same. FlyingMonkey, what was the process to convert to ELSA? How did you start? Is there a trial period or is it the fact that you're converting from a SLSA to ELSA it just becomes a paperwork conversion?

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CTSleepy, here's the text of the email the DAR sent me of the requirements:



The process for doing the conversion is fairly simple; it involves some upfront paperwork coordination between you and me and an inspection of your airplane by me at the Winder Airport.  The cost would be $500.  Here are the steps below:

 

1.                   At the time of my certification visit, you would need to submit a completed FAA Form 8130-6 Application for Airworthiness form and a “Program Letter”-- I can help you complete those ahead of time.
 

2.                   You would need to email me photocopies of the following documents for my review ahead of time.

a.                   Current registration certificate

b.                  SLSA airworthiness certificate

c.                   SLSA operating limitations document

d.                  Current empty weight and balance

e.                  Original FAA Form 8130-15 from when the aircraft was certificated as an SLSA.

f.                    Manufacturer’s ground test, flight test, and final inspection records—these may be logbook entries or separate paper forms, depending on how the manufacturer does it.

g.                   A photo of your fireproof aircraft dataplate, showing at least the aircraft manufacturer, model, and serial number (which should match your registration certificate character-for-character

h.                  Logbook entries showing that the aircraft had an annual condition inspection within the last twelve months and that it included a test of the Emergency Locator Transmitter (ELT).

i.                     Evidence that all manufacturer’s Safety Alerts have been complied with

j.                    Evidence that any modifications to the aircraft were approved in writing by the manufacturer
 

3.                   I would need to verify that you have a manufacturer’s Pilot Operating Handbook (POH) for your specific aircraft model and serial number and a manufacturer’s Flight Training Supplement (which may be included in the POH or may be a separate document).  If you have these as computer files, you could email them to me.  If not, I would look at them during the certification visit.
 

4.                   When I arrive for the certification, you would surrender your existing SLSA airworthiness certificate and operating limitations document to me.  You would need to have the engine cowling and some of the access covers removed so I can do my inspection.  In addition to a general inspection, I would be looking for the following.

a.                   Current transponder/encoder test

b.                  All equipment installed per POH

c.                   All placards installed per POH
 

5.                   There are a couple of placard changes that would need to be made.

a.                   You’d need to remove the placard(s) on the outside of the airplane that say “LIGHT SPORT.”

b.                  You’d need to install new placard(s) that says “EXPERIMENTAL.”  The letters must be 2” high and the placard(s) must be visible from any entrance.  Oftentimes it is possible to use only one such placard on the aft baggage compartment bulkhead, just so long as it is easily visible from both doors.

c.                   You’d need to remove the existing passenger warning placard and replace it with another one stating that the aircraft is an ELSA (for example, Aircraft Spruce P/N 09-01966).
 

6.                   My inspection would probably take 2-3 hours.  Once it was done, I would hand you a new ELSA airworthiness certificate and operating limitations document and we would be finished.

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17 minutes ago, FlyingMonkey said:

Does that pitot include AOA?  How much did it cost?  I asked Arian a few years back for an AOA pitot, and he said Germany required a $1500 engineering study by FD to add an AOA pitot.  🙄

Yeah I basically got told the same, then it was going to be too expensive and not an option. 

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Includes AOA, which I have hooked up and working.  Went in the same hole.  Had to use 4mm tubing instead of 6mm if I remember right but don't hold me to that.  A bit tricky fishing the wiring and tubing in the same race but I did it.

I've touched the pitot tube when turned on and it gets warm.

Heated Pitot1.jpg

Heated Pitot2.jpg

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1 hour ago, Jim Meade said:

Includes AOA, which I have hooked up and working.  Went in the same hole.  Had to use 4mm tubing instead of 6mm if I remember right but don't hold me to that.  A bit tricky fishing the wiring and tubing in the same race but I did it.

I've touched the pitot tube when turned on and it gets warm.

Heated Pitot1.jpg

Heated Pitot2.jpg

Jim is there anyway you can give me the diameter of the pitot tube where it enters the leading edge, even a ballpark diameter would help.  I message Arian this AM and he came back saying it would not fit my current boom hole, but the pic you shared sure does tell a different story.  Arian said the pitot boom at point of entry is 19mm or about 3/4" in diameter.  Your pic sure does make it look a bit smaller.

Thanks for the pics, this is getting me closer to a straight answer

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