Bill3558 Posted November 4, 2021 Report Share Posted November 4, 2021 I’m looking at different CTs to buy. One plane I looked at was all up to date except the chute repack expired several months ago. Owner declined to do it because he said that buyers “don’t care about that”. Labeled the chute handle “inop” I care a lot about that since I pulled the ownership transfer handle a few weeks ago. I told them I wasn’t interested unless they do the repack first. Curios to know what you guys think. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FlyingMonkey Posted November 4, 2021 Report Share Posted November 4, 2021 Not really an issue technically. But if it’s an SLSA the airplane is required to have an up-to-date chute to remain airworthy. You can’t legally fly the airplane with an out of date chute unless it’s an ELSA. You can’t just label the chute INOP and go about your business. You might be able to reach out to FDUSA and get them to issue an LOA to allow flight back to your home base until you can get the chute repacked. If you buy the airplane, knock 2k off the price, for the repack and inconvenience of this problem. In a larger sense, you might want to pass on the airplane. Unless this is an ELSA, the owner clearly is not aware of what is legal for the airplane and what maintenance is required. Or he just doesn’t care. I’d wonder what other shortcuts or violations might be waiting to be discovered after you have the airplane and paid your money. It could get costly. At the very least get a CT expert to go over that airplane with a fine-toothed comb. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anticept Posted November 4, 2021 Report Share Posted November 4, 2021 There is no Flight Design approval to fly the airplane without maintenance compliance with the BRS. Last year, the 12 year service cost me $3500 plus shipping, and if someone else maintained it, it would have cost a couple hundred more in labor. That said, for legal basis: I tried to find a reference in the AOI about BRS maintenance. Nothing. Maybe there's a safety directive covering this. There is supposed to be a small paper packet though that is specific to your airplane that should be with the airplane logbooks that has instructions for ongoing maintenance that mechanics should be using. It's basically the ICA or Instructions for Continued Airworthiness. I don't have mine in front of me to review. Regardless, marking it inop is technically an alteration, and FDUSA actually has a specific approval document on their website to fly the airplane to a maintenance facility with an inoperative parachute where it can be serviced. That's the only case for an S-LSA to fly without it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sandpiper Posted November 4, 2021 Report Share Posted November 4, 2021 Yep, at least $4K should be taken off the price for costs and inconvenience of getting the chute up to date. Also, make sure you get a pre-buy from someone who knows what they are looking at. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom Baker Posted November 4, 2021 Report Share Posted November 4, 2021 If it is just the parachute repack cycle take off 2k. If it is the chute and rocket take off 4K. I would not feel uncomfortable moving the plane to someplace where it can be rectified, but make sure you get either a special flight permit, or approval from Flight Design. IIRC there was a member here who bought an airplane in Cali and ferried it back east with a parachute that had timed out, with an approval from Flight Design. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BravoFoxtrot Posted November 4, 2021 Report Share Posted November 4, 2021 BRS's current price for the the BRS-6 1350HS as are installed on CTs: Repack $1,815.00 Repack with new rocket $3,355.00 Add labor for your repairman, shipping, and maybe sales tax. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warmi Posted November 4, 2021 Report Share Posted November 4, 2021 That’s not too bad ..you guys are lucky with BRS chutes … I just paid $7000 for 10 year repack/new rocket on my GRS parachute ( delivery from EU + US based labor at SportAir ) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
airhound Posted November 5, 2021 Report Share Posted November 5, 2021 22 hours ago, BravoFoxtrot said: BRS's current price for the the BRS-6 1350HS as are installed on CTs: Repack $1,815.00 Repack with new rocket $3,355.00 Add labor for your repairman, shipping, and maybe sales tax. How and why that much for a repack? ‘Because they are the only show in town/patent process and liability? What else?’ Otherwise, is there a special process to shake it out, inspect and get it back in the canister or can your average rigger perform that, if it’s ELSA? ok, pile on, I’m sure I’ve incensed some ole codger out there! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skunkworks85 Posted November 5, 2021 Report Share Posted November 5, 2021 27 minutes ago, BugBuster (BB) said: How and why that much for a repack? ‘Because they are the only show in town and liability? What else?’ Otherwise, is there a special process to shake it out, inspect and get it back in the canister or can your average rigger perform that, if it’s ELSA? ok, pile on, I’m sure I’ve incensed some ole codger out there! There is a Huge process involved, with heating up the material and putting into a press, and many man hours of inspection time. The actual repacking requires a special oven and is pressed into the canister under extremely high pressure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
airhound Posted November 5, 2021 Report Share Posted November 5, 2021 Thank you for the education. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anticept Posted November 5, 2021 Report Share Posted November 5, 2021 The soft-pack chutes are the ones that can be field inspected. Hard case, as skunkworks said, is an INTENSE process. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FlyingMonkey Posted November 5, 2021 Report Share Posted November 5, 2021 Yeah, it's not like a regular parachute, it is really crammed in there and the pack is critical to successful deployment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
airhound Posted November 6, 2021 Report Share Posted November 6, 2021 What’s the probability a 10 plus year non-repacked/rocket BRS system would perform as designed? Wonder what accounts for the delta between GRS 10 years 7k and BRS specs? Why the difference? Is there EAB and ELSA actual deployment data on length of time between repack and rocket replacement? Just wondering how much of a performance reliability buffer is factored into SLSA systems compared to overdo repack/rocket EAB successful deployments? Just a swag will do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warmi Posted November 6, 2021 Report Share Posted November 6, 2021 I don’t have any specs on BRS but according to guy who does GRS rocket replacements they all looked good after being replaced so they do last a lot longer. In this accident a guy severely over stressed his plane attempting to escape an imminent collision with a twin and successfully pulled the parachute.The parachute was 3 years past its repack date and it worked just fine. http://www.kathrynsreport.com/2018/11/tl-ultralight-sting-sport-n494n.html Personally, since I picked a plane equipped with a parachute, I made the choice to keep it up to date and not roll the dice… As far as price differences between GRS and BRS - I am pretty sure it is due to the fact that GRS is manufactured in Europe and there are only 2 dealers in the US doing repacks..so they can charge pretty much what they want. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
airhound Posted November 6, 2021 Report Share Posted November 6, 2021 Thanks Warmi. My only experience with hitting the silk was jumping Army T-10s a 150 years ago. Obviously, this and previous accident saves are priceless. Other than wrong installations, wonder if packed condition defects are noted by the MFGs on chutes? I’m guessing they would be more environmental like moisture exposure rather than operations impact on suspension lines due to years of turbulence and maneuvering G’s? All before I’m just guessing. Anyone have other ideas regarding what Impacts performance of packed chutes which the MFG repack requirements address. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BravoFoxtrot Posted November 6, 2021 Report Share Posted November 6, 2021 The T-10s had to be repacked every 120 days. Part of the concern was if left for too long it may develop a crease where folded and then split on that crease when it inflated. Should that happen it could ruin the rest of your day. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
procharger Posted November 6, 2021 Report Share Posted November 6, 2021 I have not heard of a cute packed like ours in a can ever needing replacement only repacked. BRS has to stay in business somehow Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger Lee Posted November 6, 2021 Report Share Posted November 6, 2021 Cirrus aircraft get repacks at a whole lot more than we pay. Plus GRS chutes get repacked in a number of planes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andyb Posted November 7, 2021 Report Share Posted November 7, 2021 Yes, as a perspective, Cirrus is $18,000-$20,000. And, they've had huge delays in getting them done...major AOG issues. This has gone back for quite a while. Big deal in the Cirrus community. On Cirrus, the Cirrus factory is the only one authorized to do it. Not to diminish our absolute cost, but relative to Cirrus, we're considerably cheaper and easier. Andy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
airhound Posted November 7, 2021 Report Share Posted November 7, 2021 How often are they repacked? Probably the early V-tails would have had these, if available back then. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.