Meditating Valhalla

[C ICEY]

land of the free and home of the brave.

 

watch out for air pockets, boys.

[CT4ME]

OMG!!! and a #$%!!?#***!!! for good measure. Incredible.

Tim

[bitten192]

 

 

35 bucks worth of fuel and a beautiful flight on another windless day.......

 

enjoy

 

ICEYtheCT channel,

on YouTube.

Hate to be a "spoil sport" but best practice is to cross mountain ridges 1500' above them and at a 45 degree angle. :blush: a little downdraft on a "windless day" crossing some of those ridges could put you in valhalla.

 

Ernie

CFI

[thecapt]

I agree with bitten192. That's a pretty scary film. People put themselves in very dangerous situations and get away with it every day, but every once in a while, they have to be rescued or recovered. The people who fly like this should NOT be admired, but pittied for their lack of common sense. Flying that close to mountains is NOT a very good idea.

[C ICEY]

Sorry if I offended anyone.

 

I reserve my pity for those of stunted spirit.

[CT4ME]

I don't think anyone is advocating flying unsafely... based on what I've seen over the years, C-Icey would qualify as an very experienced mountain flyer. I guess a new warning label is needed: "This video features flying done by an experienced professional... don't try this at home!"

CFI is right, when you're flying OVER the mountains, going somewhere. I think different rules apply when the whole point of your flight is flying in/around the mountains.

I have a feeling a perfect flying day like this is pretty rare... thanks for sharing it

Tim

[bseager]

I think the issue really is the level of risk each of us is willing to accept in our flying. All of us are willing to accept some risk or we would not be flying at all. For some it is nothing to take off with a 15 knot gusty crosswind, others wouldn’t think about it. Mountain flying is just like sitting in your easy chair if you pick the right day, the only issue is the inhospitable terrain if you need to make a forced landing. For those that live and fly in the mountains regularly it is easy to know when to stay on the ground and I think it is fair to say that nobody posting these videos would fly in close proximity to the downwind side of ridges if there was any significant wind. So I disagree that the video represented excessively risky flying and after all, why do you own a CT if not to take you to spectacular scenery and places.

[Roger Fane]

Hopefully, every pilot is weighing the risks every time they leave the ground. It is a question of how much risk you are willing to take, and what experience you have. Some have a lot more experience in the mountains. Some that come to the annual Page fly-in like to stay up high, where some of us like the view from 100' AGL on Lake Powell and Monument Valley, and are comfortable taking the risk of diminished options. To each their own. I've safely flown a couple hundred feet over the top of Mount St. Helens (yes, I was above the ceiling of the TFR), where others in our group were more comfortable circling a mile away and a thousand + feet higher.

[josjonkers]

Hate to be a "spoil sport" but best practice is to cross mountain ridges 1500' above them and at a 45 degree angle. :blush: a little downdraft on a "windless day" crossing some of those ridges could put you in valhalla.

 

Ernie

CFI

 

 

I feel compelled to add my 2 cents to this discussion.

Ernie refers to best practices, yet in every day flying we regularly ignore best practices (cross wind limits, max wind limits, vfr ceiling limtits below cloud base to name a few) and we do this understanding and calulating the risk associated with this. If conditions allow I have "waived" my best practices limits numerous times understanding and managing the increased risk. Different pilots have different experience levels that will allow us to manage risks in different fashions. I myself am an avid mountain flyer with over 1000 hours mountain flying experience. Although I love flying in the mountains there have been many days where I have chosen not to fly there due to unfavourable weather conditions.

Knowing Mike personally and vouching for his experience and skills, the impression that what he is doing in the videos is not safe is unwarranted. Although I am not familiar with the actual day of his flight, on close observation I conclude the he was flying early in the morning when daytime heating was not a factor, on a day where the winds were dead calm (as evidenced by the GLASS surface of the mountain lakes)and under these very select and rare conditions this type of flying can be done quite safely; it becomes a matter of managing risk! Obviously one has to have great comfort in the airplane you fly including the mechanical conditions of all components but this is no different from flying to the Bahamas or to Jamaica or any other flights over unlandable terrain.

I am sure that Mike does not try to encourage less experienced mountain flying proficient pilots to do this type of flying and both Mike and I have gradually build up our experience in this area over the years where we are familiar with the terrain, understand the winds and "sucker" spots on given days and for me personally I often scout out a certain flight from a higher altitude to understand the risks involved.

For Ernie to blindly refer to the "best practices rule book" and declaring this unsafe is interesting but as with all limits (we sometimes take for granted as outlined above)these limtits depend on the individual and particular conditions of the day.

 

I hope to see more of Mike's videos!

 

Regards,

 

Jos

[chanik]

One key technique that C-ICEY clearly uses is to approach ridges at speed. That way he can cut through any sudden downdraft quickly or pop up, if needed, and convert kinetic to vertical energy. When I was flying Cessnas and Traumahauks, it wasn't often even possible to clear ridges here in the Sierra Nevadas by 1500' where I fly often. About Va is what I use in the CT, or 98kts so that plane will at least hit the ridge in one piece. The 45 deg angle is very key as well when there is wind to ensure an escape path if you need to peel away and many pilots don't seem to know these things. Bottom line is this sort of flying can be done safely with care and experience and it can certainly be done very unsafely without those things.